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Tim Heiss

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #120 on: April 20, 2017, 01:22:42 PM »

Getting a job seems like a pretty good way of finding some money to pay for healthcare.  If you don't care about your health why should I
Some people work 2 jobs and STILL don't have the money to go to the doctor. But hey, as long as you got your Medicare why should you care.
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The Fuzz

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #121 on: April 20, 2017, 02:05:02 PM »

There has always seemed to be a lack of understanding from some on her Tim that there truly are people working as you say that live pay check to pay check just to cover food and necessities.  I gave up on trying to defend those people unless it is blatant taking advantage of the system (now wouldn't that be an interesting study and data?).  Some just generally think of them as deserving of their situations without understanding the facts.

It is difficult to understand/comprehend the plight of the disadvantaged in this country without first hand experience in it, those that have not will never understand the situation.
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Tim Heiss

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #122 on: April 20, 2017, 02:52:54 PM »

Fuzz, when I was growing up we had every thing we ever wanted. I had 2 motor cycles and we lived in a 3000 square foot house with a cottage in the lake. I say cottage but it was also a 5 bedroom home.

Later, my dad's business went bankrupt. He had started up a foam insulation business but there was formaldehyde in the chemical composition. My dad and mom got divorced and I went from living high on the hog to eating pb&j and damn happy I had jelly.

So I've been on both sides of the fence and I've worked hard to get to where I am today, but I also know I'm one of the lucky ones and STILL have friends and family that work hard and are struggling to pay the bills.

When I see statements like those above it makes me want to scream because they have no idea what they're talking about.

Are there those that take advantage of the system? Sure. I'd like more investigations done to root those people out, but that too would cost money.
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blue2

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #123 on: April 20, 2017, 02:55:57 PM »

I paid dearly for my medicare
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blue2

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #124 on: April 20, 2017, 02:59:56 PM »

I can remember when I and my bother an sister were 8-12 and my dad was in an accident and couldn't work for a few months. My parents got permission to comb thru farmers corn fields picking up loose corn and selling to the local elevator so we could eat or maybe paid medical bills..
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The Fuzz

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #125 on: April 20, 2017, 03:29:04 PM »

Fuzz, when I was growing up we had every thing we ever wanted. I had 2 motor cycles and we lived in a 3000 square foot house with a cottage in the lake. I say cottage but it was also a 5 bedroom home.

Later, my dad's business went bankrupt. He had started up a foam insulation business but there was formaldehyde in the chemical composition. My dad and mom got divorced and I went from living high on the hog to eating pb&j and damn happy I had jelly.

So I've been on both sides of the fence and I've worked hard to get to where I am today, but I also know I'm one of the lucky ones and STILL have friends and family that work hard and are struggling to pay the bills.

When I see statements like those above it makes me want to scream because they have no idea what they're talking about.

Are there those that take advantage of the system? Sure. I'd like more investigations done to root those people out, but that too would cost money.

My experience was just reversed.....mine was childhood through high school.  Saw both sides clearly.

I paid dearly for my medicare

Me too, looking forward to that little bit of safety net when the time comes here in a few years.

I can remember when I and my bother an sister were 8-12 and my dad was in an accident and couldn't work for a few months. My parents got permission to comb thru farmers corn fields picking up loose corn and selling to the local elevator so we could eat or maybe paid medical bills..

Same thing with corn fields when I was a kid with my family; we did that for years.  Some extra well needed cash.  I caught on quick that the place to look was the end of the rows where those old one and two row pickers made turns.

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Tim Heiss

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #126 on: April 20, 2017, 03:40:02 PM »

I paid dearly for my medicare
I continue to pay dearly for your Medicare you socialist.
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blue2

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #127 on: April 20, 2017, 04:04:57 PM »

Now you tell me about the ends.
Yeah, I think back in 50's early 60's they mostly had just 2 row pickers..
I use to help my uncle and cousins pick maybe 5 acres by hand.  Had a husker to strap on over the  glove to pull husk off and flip in wagon.  one of the girls got the job of driving the tractor..
« Last Edit: April 20, 2017, 08:27:10 PM by blue2 »
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John Kopke

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #128 on: April 20, 2017, 08:18:42 PM »

We also had the Bush tax cuts and trillions spent on war which only profited the ultra rich and drove the regular working Joe deeper in debt.

What's the solution John, more tax cuts for the rich?

Tim:

I see your argument is faltering. I know this because you're going partisan. Blaming Bush won't work with me, because I also blame Bush for much of our current predicament. The Iraq war was a major blunder. It ultimately led to the total chaos we find in the Middle East today, cost us trillions of dollars, not to mention service folks dead, maimed etc. But don't forget Hillary and other Dems voted for the war and Obama completely fudged up the   
aftermath.

Then there was Bush teaming up with Alan Greenspan to boost the sagging economy back in 2001 with significant Keynesian interest rates cuts, along with government backed lower home lending standards, which were also backed by Dems. Result. The housing boom, and then bust. Meanwhile, the national debt rose from $ 5 trillion to $ 10 trillion. This was a combination of unpaid tax cuts, war costs, and bank bailouts. Bush left the country a total mess and heading into a major recession.

Then Obama took over. Greenspan was gone, so Obama hooked up Bernanke. Recessions are
bad politics. Greenspan had busted the housing boom when he raised interest rates to cool things off. This absolutely killed the folks with adjustable rate mortgages, especially the sub-prime borrowers resulting in the bust. So what did Obama and Bernanke decide to do? Double down! Bernanke went with a zero prime interest rate for 8 years, and printed out of thin air another $ 3.7 trillion for good measure. Not to be outdone, Obama (and the Congress) tacked on another $ 10 trillion of government deficit spending. Without going into detail, this has created a huge stock market bubble, devastated savers returns, and the only folks really benefitting are Wall Street speculators. And yet Obama and the Dems decry an income inequality that they were complicit in creating!!!

Bottom line Tim. The Government/Fed geniuses teamed up to make things look good politically in the short term, while taking care of the elite, but at the same time they were fundamentally undermining the financial foundation of the country, and everyday folks.

So what is my answer Tim? Cut government spending big time, including defense (a couple hundred billion). Do not reduce taxes. SS and Medicare need to be cut by means testing. Rich folks benefits cut dramatically. Fair? No. They paid into these programs. But we have no choice. Dump federal departments like Education ($ 70 billion) etc. etc. Not downsize, eliminate. Review all Federal regulations. Many are counter productive. Get rid of them. Rein in the Fed, big time. Return to Gold backed dollars. No more printing. Set a goal to reduce spending a trillion dollars a year. So Tim, these are just a few things I would do to reverse our country's fiscal death spiral.

Now it's your turn.

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John Kopke

Tim Heiss

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #129 on: April 21, 2017, 03:48:37 AM »

Chiding me for going partisan from the man who states Dems are slimy vermin isn't going to win you any prizes John.

As far as your post goes, I'd say it's fairly accurate except for the part of Obama pulling out of Iraq, he really didn't have much choice as the government that we helped create had asked us to leave. You can argue that point if you wish but I'll just say that he screwed up enough other things in the Middle East that you needn't bother.

Now as far as your answer.

Social Security would be solvent if the cap was raised.

Got no problem with reigning in the Fed.

Education needs a boost not cuts.

Cutting federal spending by 1/3 is just not feasible and might even send the economy into a tailspin it couldn't pull out of. Cutting the military would be a good idea but will never fly under this administration.

First goal should be to stop spending more than we are taking in. Eliminating the Bush tax cuts would also help things emensly.
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Monroe Native

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #130 on: April 22, 2017, 07:17:34 AM »

First goal should be to stop spending more than we are taking in. Eliminating the Bush tax cuts would also help things emensly.

Emensly?

How would that help anything?

Taking money out of the private sector, and putting it in the hands of Government that always needs more more more - how does that help?
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Monroe Native

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #131 on: April 22, 2017, 07:20:23 AM »

I continue to pay dearly for your Medicare you socialist.

It amazes me how this Democratic spawned "Insurance" program has just turned into another "entitlement."

Are people who paid into these programs supposed to feel guilty when they take the benefits that they paid into their whole working life?

Why is that Tim?

Do we have a CHOICE on if we participate in this INSURANCE plan?

I guess in your view it should just be a needs based program - and those of us who work and save money for retirement should get nothing back out of what we paid in - until we are broke?

Is that your point?
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I have learned that only two things are necessary to keep one's wife happy. First, let her think she's having her own way. And second, let her have it.
Lyndon B. Johnson

You do not examine legislation in the light of the benefits it will convey if properly administered, but in the light of the wrongs it would do and the harms it would cause if improperly administered.
Lyndon B. Johnson

Tim Heiss

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #132 on: April 22, 2017, 10:00:20 AM »

It amazes me how this Democratic spawned "Insurance" program has just turned into another "entitlement."

Are people who paid into these programs supposed to feel guilty when they take the benefits that they paid into their whole working life?

Why is that Tim?

Do we have a CHOICE on if we participate in this INSURANCE plan?

I guess in your view it should just be a needs based program - and those of us who work and save money for retirement should get nothing back out of what we paid in - until we are broke?

Is that your point?
Not at all.

My point is many people here view things as evil until they benefit from it, just like Ayn Rand who was against Social Security until it came time for her to collect.
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Tim Heiss

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #133 on: April 22, 2017, 10:06:26 AM »

Do not reduce taxes. SS and Medicare need to be cut by means testing. Rich folks benefits cut dramatically.
Monroe Native, you have anything to say about this?
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Monroe Native

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Re: Obamacare II?
« Reply #134 on: April 22, 2017, 01:03:15 PM »

Monroe Native, you have anything to say about this?

I have no doubt it's going to happen Tim - and when it does - let me ask you a question?

Why would anyone save any money for retirement - if you are then declared rich and denied the "insurance benefits" you and your employer were forced to pay into?

At that point - why not just refuse to work at all?  I mean - do what gets you the most Government Cheese - right?

Who is going to pay the taxes then?

But hey - we can keep the programs "solvent" for a few more years according to the Republicans - all it takes is not living up to the Government end of the agreement.
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I have learned that only two things are necessary to keep one's wife happy. First, let her think she's having her own way. And second, let her have it.
Lyndon B. Johnson

You do not examine legislation in the light of the benefits it will convey if properly administered, but in the light of the wrongs it would do and the harms it would cause if improperly administered.
Lyndon B. Johnson
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