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Categories => Businesses => Topic started by: BigRedDog on February 21, 2015, 11:46:21 AM

Title: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 21, 2015, 11:46:21 AM
We were out there 'walking' Wednesday evening...

My wife's foot has been bothering her (working on concrete floors all day) so she really didn't want to walk as fast as I was trying to go...   so I asked her to make a list of the 'still open' stores out there!

She wrote down 38 business names...

a couple of them are just the little booths...   we counted the ones that were staffed and skipped over the ones that were just coin operated!

We did count both Carson's regular store and their 'Home Store' as individual businesses although I'm thinking if one goes then the other would probably go!

We've heard that the Hallmark Card store will be opening again...   and it looks like it's ready to go...   all it needs is inventory!  All the fixtures look like they're right where they were all along!

One issue that makes me wonder is that when Pat Catan's announced they were going to move to the mall they also announced they'd be closing their store on S. Dixie in Monroe Township...   but that didn't happen!  They've downsized it for use as a 'clearance' store but they haven't closed it as originally planned...

could that be a clue that maybe they don't see a long future at the mall ??? ??? ???

The wifi if finally off at the Target store...  they've got the drywall 'door' sanded down to where it's ready for some primer or sealer and then some paint! 

Anyone want to venture a guess or a prediction as to what will happen...

and when ??? ??? ???
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Mayonnaise on February 21, 2015, 12:11:39 PM
Lately every-time I go there, I picture the mall chase scene in movie, The Blues Brothers.
Who know's, the way movies are being remade and remade again.
But then again, if and when it does go completely out, I've mentioned before, a mini Gibraltar Trade Center with Flea Market.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ell on February 21, 2015, 01:39:28 PM
Gee, if the mall closes, where will people go to walk?  Maybe they will be able to walk online where they do all their shopping.  It seems many people are gleeful in hoping for it's failure and that of the downtown area.  They can then marvel at their clairvoyance.

Malls a dying off everywhere, so it doesn't take a crystal ball to see the future of the mall here.  The malls and the big box stores killed off many downtowns and now the internet will probably do the same to the malls.

Just my two cents worth.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: The Fuzz on February 21, 2015, 01:46:26 PM
LOL, Mayo.....great scene, and made me think about watching the 40 year SNL anniversary show last night.

ell......I agree, but not gleeful at all about the struggles of the downtown and the mall.  I do believe though that it was more the expansion of the big box stores into combined grocery and general merchandise market.  The internet sales....not so much, there are still plenty of shoppers out there but go for the convenience factor.  If that amount of shoppers were to converge onto the downtown and mall areas then folks would be complaining about no parking and too congested.

The common small town American malls are dying all across the country.  The company stores starved them out.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on February 21, 2015, 03:25:23 PM
I think they need to get some alternative use going--get someone in there that will generate some foot traffic even if it isn't retail.   There was recently an article about a mall in Nashville that was dead that they converted about 1/2 to medical offices and the other half kept retail which is now going strong.

In general I find shopping in Monroe harder and harder to do.   I almost never find everything I'm looking for.   I get so sick of hearing "we can order it for you".   Yeah, I can order it for me too and have it at my door in a day or two.   Finding myself ordering more and more online even if I know I can drive across town to get half of it.  Maybe that would be true in a bigger city too though as stores shrink inventory?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on February 21, 2015, 04:24:04 PM
I think they need to get some alternative use going--get someone in there that will generate some foot traffic even if it isn't retail.   There was recently an article about a mall in Nashville that was dead that they converted about 1/2 to medical offices and the other half kept retail which is now going strong.

Thats a good idea and something thats occuring in Adrian at the Adrian mall right now.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 21, 2015, 04:26:41 PM
Gee, if the mall closes, where will people go to walk?  Maybe they will be able to walk online where they do all their shopping.  It seems many people are gleeful in hoping for it's failure and that of the downtown area.  They can then marvel at their clairvoyance.

Malls a dying off everywhere, so it doesn't take a crystal ball to see the future of the mall here.  The malls and the big box stores killed off many downtowns and now the internet will probably do the same to the malls.

Just my two cents worth.


That's a major question... 

when it gets ultra cold like we've had I can't walk outside anymore...

when I was younger I didn't need to and now I really don't want to...

maybe I could but not sure!!!

Lately every-time I go there, I picture the mall chase scene in movie, The Blues Brothers.
Who know's, the way movies are being remade and remade again.
But then again, if and when it does go completely out, I've mentioned before, a mini Gibraltar Trade Center with Flea Market.



Excellent idea...   

use it for a movie shoot!!!  Except I think I read yesterday that the state is having to quit giving any tax credits to the movie industry due to the impending budget deficit fiasco!!!

www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIdGxR-aU6o (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IIdGxR-aU6o#)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 21, 2015, 04:29:47 PM
I think they need to get some alternative use going--get someone in there that will generate some foot traffic even if it isn't retail.   There was recently an article about a mall in Nashville that was dead that they converted about 1/2 to medical offices and the other half kept retail which is now going strong.

Thats a good idea and something thats occuring in Adrian at the Adrian mall right now.

Doesn't seem like anything they've tried in the Toledo market has helped...

a mall closing there is a regular occurrence lately!

I just realized when we did out store count we left out Planet Fitness...   They're strictly an outside entrance from the mall.  Their place and the theater might both survive just fine even if the rest of the mall were to close up!!!
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Mayonnaise on February 21, 2015, 05:33:33 PM
Doesn't seem like anything they've tried in the Toledo market has helped...

a mall closing there is a regular occurrence lately!

I just realized when we did out store count we left out Planet Fitness...   They're strictly an outside entrance from the mall.  Their place and the theater might both survive just fine even if the rest of the mall were to close up!!!
I don't know about that. I've been to the Franklin Park Mall in Toledo at least once a month and that Mall seems to be doing well. Good crowd every time I go.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: livewire on February 21, 2015, 11:00:03 PM
I'm thinking we could put in a 100 yard indoor rifle range in there somewhere.
Maybe a gun shop along with it...

Anybody interested in pitching in?  Funding it by myself would be a stretch.  But I could do the majority shareholder...

I think it would be awesome.   ;D
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: arpydave on February 22, 2015, 07:00:21 AM
I predict it will go under. They lost JC Penny and Sears and now Target. The only thing  left is exercise walkers and the movie theater.  And movies will be a thing of the past soon as Redbox,Neflix and other streaming takes over. Evidence Is the recent movie The Interview.

Thats how it went down in hard print. You used to buy a book or newspaper but now you download it.

Northtown Mall was great when it opened but aint been around for years.  Franklin Park still has good stuff i go out of my way for.  Nice food court too.

Other than the movie or walking is there anything at the mall youd go out of your way for that you cant get at a big box store?  Didnt think so. And like i said the movie is gonna be a thing of the past in the digital age.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 22, 2015, 08:46:35 AM
I'm thinking we could put in a 100 yard indoor rifle range in there somewhere.
Maybe a gun shop along with it...

Anybody interested in pitching in?  Funding it by myself would be a stretch.  But I could do the majority shareholder...

I think it would be awesome.   ;D

If you could get the whole mall you could shoot from the food court all the way down the main walkway and into the former Target store...   according to Google maps that's almost 1100 feet!!!

https://www.google.com/maps/place/Monroe,+MI/@41.9466884,-83.3875902,520m/data= (https://www.google.com/maps/place/Monroe,+MI/@41.9466884,-83.3875902,520m/data=)!3m1!1e3!4m2!3m1!1s0x883b6fa6b2cc2bcd:0x1aff3b8ff9f0d231
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Frenchfry on February 22, 2015, 09:45:21 AM
For those planning to visit a mall...please be vigilant:

Terror group Al-Shabaab has released a video calling for attacks on shopping malls in Canada, the UK and the United States.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/02/21/us/al-shabaab-calls-for-mall-attacks/ (http://www.cnn.com/2015/02/21/us/al-shabaab-calls-for-mall-attacks/)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 22, 2015, 09:47:24 AM
For those planning to visit a mall...please be vigilant:

Terror group Al-Shabaab has released a video calling for attacks on shopping malls in Canada, the UK and the United States.
[url]http://www.cnn.com/2015/02/21/us/al-shabaab-calls-for-mall-attacks/[/url] ([url]http://www.cnn.com/2015/02/21/us/al-shabaab-calls-for-mall-attacks/[/url])


I'm guessing the Mall of Monroe is probably pretty low on their 'hit list'...

they want to go somewhere there are people!!!
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on February 23, 2015, 08:41:40 AM
The movie production companies have a pretty firm grip on the distribution of their product.   I don't see them going to a model like The Interview and giving up 1/2+ of their ticket sales selling rentals for $5 a pop.   The VCR could have just as easily done them in as streaming media.

I recall reading when Target announced their closing that they owned their actual building.   Surprised Cafaro didn't jump on buying it given their excitement over the mall's future.  8*   If that space gets re-occupied with retail I see it getting split into a few units because who else is there that takes that big of a box?   Even then, there's plenty of open space north of Lowes and Walmart for new development and its much more visible so filling space in a mall with an uncertain future is going to be tough.   Plus the La-Z-Boy site is on the market now and will likely be vacant before summer since rumor has it they are starting to move in the next couple weeks.

If Ann Arbor can support a nice gun shop that's building a range, surely Monroe can.   Offer rentals for those of us who aren't gun owners but would like to occasionally shoot and I'll come.   
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Debimark on February 23, 2015, 09:06:48 AM
Considering that (the former) Mercy-Memorial Hospital owns (or at least used to own) the property behind the Stewart Road Rehabilitation Center, I always thought all that property could be used for a Mature Living Campus. Further, if Mall of Monroe ever ceases operation, why not try to convert the stores into multiple apartments. There is, with some modification, an indoor walking path, plenty of parking, and what would almost surely be a drive connecting the aforementioned Stewart Road building. If the rest of the property gets developed you would have a quasi-Villages (FLA Development) with all living and services in one location.

Such a transformation has never been tried before, but the mall was only built in 1988 (or near), and is most likely structurally sound. I would think you could have in-house vendors, suppliers and other care providers. I am not sure if Mable Kehres, Frenchtown and River Park are exclusively Senior Housing what with the proliferation of public housing in these residences.

I don't see a retail future for the Mall, really. As mentioned, the availability of the LZB property, and the continual consolidation of brick-and-mortar retailers will change the landscape of necessary and available shopping. The Owners could keep one or two of the bigger buildings for rental income. Planet Fitness is a good fit with the Senior Housing concept.

Just a thought.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Flanders on February 23, 2015, 10:18:13 AM
I actually think that malls aren't destined to become obsolete.  Maybe ours in Monroe is, but not malls in general.
There is a huge shift going on that has manufacturers opening their own stores in malls.  Think Nike for example.  People still like to shop at a physical location; this probably won't ever change.  However, "brick and mortar" brand stores are equally as happy if you buy there, or just try on something and buy online at home.  Either way, they get the sale.  The physical storefront becomes more of an advertisement than a sales generating location.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Flanders on February 23, 2015, 10:20:52 AM

If Ann Arbor can support a nice gun shop that's building a range, surely Monroe can.   Offer rentals for those of us who aren't gun owners but would like to occasionally shoot and I'll come.   

Not to get off topic, but I totally agree.  I don't know much about gun shops or ranges, but I went to one on a whim with a group of friends.  We rented a few guns and ammo and had a blast... pun.

I often travel Airport Hwy in Toledo.  There is this gun shop that I believe has a range located close to Toledo Express Airport.  The place is ALWAYS PACKED!
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on February 23, 2015, 12:05:32 PM
That would be Clelands on Airport highway.  New facility.  The other one had a major fire a few years ago.  There aren't many places for the general public to shoot in Toledo.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on February 23, 2015, 12:25:32 PM
There is a huge shift going on that has manufacturers opening their own stores in malls.  Think Nike for example.  People still like to shop at a physical location; this probably won't ever change.  However, "brick and mortar" brand stores are equally as happy if you buy there, or just try on something and buy online at home.  Either way, they get the sale.  The physical storefront becomes more of an advertisement than a sales generating location.

We had that.   Remember the bombed out wasteland on LaPlaisance?   There was even a Nike store for a while.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: The Fuzz on February 23, 2015, 01:05:34 PM
Considering that (the former) Mercy-Memorial Hospital owns (or at least used to own) the property behind the Stewart Road Rehabilitation Center, I always thought all that property could be used for a Mature Living Campus. Further, if Mall of Monroe ever ceases operation, why not try to convert the stores into multiple apartments. There is, with some modification, an indoor walking path, plenty of parking, and what would almost surely be a drive connecting the aforementioned Stewart Road building. If the rest of the property gets developed you would have a quasi-Villages (FLA Development) with all living and services in one location.

Such a transformation has never been tried before, but the mall was only built in 1988 (or near), and is most likely structurally sound. I would think you could have in-house vendors, suppliers and other care providers. I am not sure if Mable Kehres, Frenchtown and River Park are exclusively Senior Housing what with the proliferation of public housing in these residences.

I don't see a retail future for the Mall, really. As mentioned, the availability of the LZB property, and the continual consolidation of brick-and-mortar retailers will change the landscape of necessary and available shopping. The Owners could keep one or two of the bigger buildings for rental income. Planet Fitness is a good fit with the Senior Housing concept.

Just a thought.

That's one hell of a good idea IMO.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Flanders on February 23, 2015, 01:07:47 PM
We had that.   Remember the bombed out wasteland on LaPlaisance?   There was even a Nike store for a while.

Perhaps you are correct, although I wasn't specifically referencing "outlet" stores. I hope you are wrong though.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 24, 2015, 07:53:36 AM
Considering that (the former) Mercy-Memorial Hospital owns (or at least used to own) the property behind the Stewart Road Rehabilitation Center, I always thought all that property could be used for a Mature Living Campus. Further, if Mall of Monroe ever ceases operation, why not try to convert the stores into multiple apartments. There is, with some modification, an indoor walking path, plenty of parking, and what would almost surely be a drive connecting the aforementioned Stewart Road building. If the rest of the property gets developed you would have a quasi-Villages (FLA Development) with all living and services in one location.

Such a transformation has never been tried before, but the mall was only built in 1988 (or near), and is most likely structurally sound. I would think you could have in-house vendors, suppliers and other care providers. I am not sure if Mable Kehres, Frenchtown and River Park are exclusively Senior Housing what with the proliferation of public housing in these residences.

I don't see a retail future for the Mall, really. As mentioned, the availability of the LZB property, and the continual consolidation of brick-and-mortar retailers will change the landscape of necessary and available shopping. The Owners could keep one or two of the bigger buildings for rental income. Planet Fitness is a good fit with the Senior Housing concept.

Just a thought.

Well thought out Dm!!! 

For the record...   I hope the mall is able to continue on as a mainly retail mall for a long time.  I think management will have to take a long hard look at some of the realities of 'Monroe' right now and make some positive changes both short term and long term. 

Related...   I saw a tweet yesterday that Target online has now dropped their threshold for 'free shipping' to $25. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Professor H on February 24, 2015, 08:37:07 AM
Considering that (the former) Mercy-Memorial Hospital owns (or at least used to own) the property behind the Stewart Road Rehabilitation Center, I always thought all that property could be used for a Mature Living Campus. Further, if Mall of Monroe ever ceases operation, why not try to convert the stores into multiple apartments. There is, with some modification, an indoor walking path, plenty of parking, and what would almost surely be a drive connecting the aforementioned Stewart Road building. If the rest of the property gets developed you would have a quasi-Villages (FLA Development) with all living and services in one location.

Such a transformation has never been tried before, but the mall was only built in 1988 (or near), and is most likely structurally sound. I would think you could have in-house vendors, suppliers and other care providers. I am not sure if Mable Kehres, Frenchtown and River Park are exclusively Senior Housing what with the proliferation of public housing in these residences.

I don't see a retail future for the Mall, really. As mentioned, the availability of the LZB property, and the continual consolidation of brick-and-mortar retailers will change the landscape of necessary and available shopping. The Owners could keep one or two of the bigger buildings for rental income. Planet Fitness is a good fit with the Senior Housing concept.

Just a thought.
Those plans for the senior development behind the nursing center and doctors offices were put in place years ago - but the demographics and economy likely never brought the plan in to play for the old hospital system...

Curious what Promedica and their resources will look to use that for. 

They got their traffic light just in case.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 24, 2015, 11:13:06 AM
I don't know about that. I've been to the Franklin Park Mall in Toledo at least once a month and that Mall seems to be doing well. Good crowd every time I go.


Yes, Franklin Park does seem to be the 'exception' in the Toledo area market!

When we moved here NorthTowne was fairly new and thriving...

SouthWycke was doing pretty good although it was a long drive for us.

We would go to Woodville mall to a lesser degree but still it was a 'sometimes' destination...

All are gone 'belly up' now!  I remember when FP poured a bundle into their updating and expansion...  was that what it took at the time?

By contrast, Mall of Monroe appears to be just one step ahead of the remnants of the outlet malls on Laplaisance... 

Give them credit, they did do 'some' updating a couple of years ago but I have't seen any big surge of new stores opening since then...  in fact it seems we're seeing the opposite impact right now!

Considering that (the former) Mercy-Memorial Hospital owns (or at least used to own) the property behind the Stewart Road Rehabilitation Center, I always thought all that property could be used for a Mature Living Campus. Further, if Mall of Monroe ever ceases operation, why not try to convert the stores into multiple apartments. There is, with some modification, an indoor walking path, plenty of parking, and what would almost surely be a drive connecting the aforementioned Stewart Road building. If the rest of the property gets developed you would have a quasi-Villages (FLA Development) with all living and services in one location.

Such a transformation has never been tried before, but the mall was only built in 1988 (or near), and is most likely structurally sound. I would think you could have in-house vendors, suppliers and other care providers. I am not sure if Mable Kehres, Frenchtown and River Park are exclusively Senior Housing what with the proliferation of public housing in these residences.

I don't see a retail future for the Mall, really. As mentioned, the availability of the LZB property, and the continual consolidation of brick-and-mortar retailers will change the landscape of necessary and available shopping. The Owners could keep one or two of the bigger buildings for rental income. Planet Fitness is a good fit with the Senior Housing concept.

Just a thought.


I did a quick Google search...

plenty of sites out there that document the fall of local malls and with suggestions for their re-use.

Your general idea does come up on some of the sites although I did't dig far enough to see if it's actually been successfully implemented anywhere...  especially anywhere with a location similar to Monroe!

In no particular order here are a few of the sites that caught my eye:

http://www.citylab.com/work/2013/01/7-alternatives-failing-shopping-malls/4335/ (http://www.citylab.com/work/2013/01/7-alternatives-failing-shopping-malls/4335/)

http://www.naiop.org/en/Magazine/2011/Summer-2011/Development-Ownership/Reviving-the-Dead-Old-Malls-Find-Life-with-New-Uses.aspx (http://www.naiop.org/en/Magazine/2011/Summer-2011/Development-Ownership/Reviving-the-Dead-Old-Malls-Find-Life-with-New-Uses.aspx)

http://www.useful-community-development.org/adaptive-reuse.html (http://www.useful-community-development.org/adaptive-reuse.html)

http://www.costar.com/News/Article/When-Retail-Wont-Work-Alternative-Uses-for-Converting-Former-Ghost-Malls-Back-Into-Income-Producing-Property/142285 (http://www.costar.com/News/Article/When-Retail-Wont-Work-Alternative-Uses-for-Converting-Former-Ghost-Malls-Back-Into-Income-Producing-Property/142285)

http://roomfordebate.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/04/04/101-uses-for-a-deserted-mall/?_r=0 (http://roomfordebate.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/04/04/101-uses-for-a-deserted-mall/?_r=0)

http://www.zdnet.com/article/repurposing-old-malls-into-datacenters-a-workable-idea/ (http://www.zdnet.com/article/repurposing-old-malls-into-datacenters-a-workable-idea/)

http://www.npr.org/2014/09/10/347132924/heres-whats-becoming-of-americas-dead-shopping-malls (http://www.npr.org/2014/09/10/347132924/heres-whats-becoming-of-americas-dead-shopping-malls)

http://gizmodo.com/7-dead-shopping-malls-that-found-surprising-second-live-1634073681 (http://gizmodo.com/7-dead-shopping-malls-that-found-surprising-second-live-1634073681)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on February 24, 2015, 11:18:27 AM
You can all drive down to Northtowne Mall on Alexis rd. oh wait they tore that down along with every other mall inToledo except Franklin park.  And they finally got the picture and kicked the kids out on weekends.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 24, 2015, 12:22:18 PM
You can all drive down to Northtowne Mall on Alexis rd. oh wait they tore that down along with every other mall inToledo except Franklin park.  And they finally got the picture and kicked the kids out on weekends.

I really liked NorthTowne...

maybe because I spent so much time there when I first moved down here to work.  It was on my way home and near a couple of my other regular 'hangouts'!

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Debimark on February 24, 2015, 01:28:42 PM
I miss Northtowne as well, not to mention BJ's Warehouse across the street, which was one of the first 'warehouses' I can think of (circa 1988-1992'ish?).

The demographics affected Northtowne, none the least of which was the opening of Frenchtown Square in 1988.

I foresee an industrial remodeling per se, as I can see the former Northtowne and Raceway Park as large Automotive Supplier locations in support of the Jeep Plant, and the "Automation Alleys" of I-75 and US-23. It may take 5-10 years to go, but I think it will happen.

I always thought the 'South County' Industrial areas would take off and expand, but that never happened. The uncertainty of the Whitman Center and general litigious history of the Lewis/Sterns area makes me think that area of South County will tend to stay as-is.

I don't see anything in Monroe proper, nor Dundee or North County. The Industrial Parks of Tecumseh and Britton may see some development, but I don't see very much here. Toledo is hungry for industry, and Northtowne/raceway may see a lot of marketing.

I miss Northtowne....bought my first Pioneer Stereo there from Elder-Beerman, and the Mrs. engagement rings. $2 matinee movies at 1:00 pm when working afternoons was always a fun date.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: livewire on February 24, 2015, 01:55:49 PM
Northland Mall will soon be history.

I could not imagine LOSING $250,000 a month.  But that's what they are doing.



Stripped of its last anchor stores and losing nearly $250,000 every month, the entire Northland Center mall is now in danger of shutting down.

The Southfield mall defaulted on a $31-million loan last year, and its court-appointed receiver is seeking permission to evict the few remaining tenants and board up the property. Northland opened in 1954 as one of the nation's first major suburban malls.

Oakland County Circuit Judge Wendy Potts is to consider the closure request at a hearing scheduled for Wednesday. If the judge grants permission — and no 11th-hour buyer steps forward — tenants could be sent 30-day notices and the mall could close by late April or early May.



http://www.freep.com/story/money/business/michigan/2015/02/23/judge-decide-northland-mall-can-close/23909029/ (http://www.freep.com/story/money/business/michigan/2015/02/23/judge-decide-northland-mall-can-close/23909029/)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 24, 2015, 02:00:52 PM
I remember going there shopping just a year or two after they opened!

My Mom had a sister that lived in Royal Oak.  We'd take the 'Bee Liner' train from Midland down to wherever her sister would pick us up.  We didn't take 696 to get there though...   way, way too soon for that ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: rwwjr on February 24, 2015, 07:17:48 PM
Well, believe it if you will, but I was told by a long time Mercy employee, no a PreMedica employee, the plans are already in the works for a new hospital, probably back on Stewart Rd o hospital owned property.  Dont laugh, because ProMedica is already going to build a new hospital outside of Adrian, closing Tecumseh and Adrians hospital, combining them into 1
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on February 24, 2015, 08:40:59 PM
Promedica going to spent millions downtown toledo remodeling old steam plant and build a parking garage.  They are rolling in cash.  They have a scam going.  They over bill by 10 times. Then accept about 1/10 in payment from ins co and Medicare.  Then they write off the loss on their taxes and get refunds.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: livewire on February 24, 2015, 08:52:21 PM
Promedica going to spent millions downtown toledo remodeling old steam plant and build a parking garage.  They are rolling in cash.  They have a scam going.  They over bill by 10 times. Then accept about 1/10 in payment from ins co and Medicare.  Then they write off the loss on their taxes and get refunds.

That's no different than any other hospital.  Going to get worse, now that we have Obamacare.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on February 24, 2015, 10:05:22 PM
I'm sure they are all the same
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 25, 2015, 07:43:22 AM
I'm sure they are all the same

I'm sure the tax laws they operate under are all equal ;) ;) ;)

Just like for individual taxpayers...

it's what individuals and any business does with those laws that vary!
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Debimark on February 25, 2015, 07:48:14 AM
https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9394458,-83.3931911,1102m/data= (https://www.google.com/maps/@41.9394458,-83.3931911,1102m/data=)!3m1!1e3

The open spaces behind the Stewart Road Building, and the paved roadway to the new Oncology/Radiation Building do lend credibility to a great place for a new Hospital. Makes sense when you see it from an overhead perspective.

A great way to tie-in with an existing Assisted Living Facility (Magnum Care), and a redesign of the Mall into Senior Apartments.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 25, 2015, 07:53:08 AM
And if they tie it all to Mall Road they can all swing through the new Starbucks on their way to work since they won't have to make a left turn ;) ;) ;)

ProMedica has pockets deep enough to pull all that off I'd guess.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Debimark on February 25, 2015, 08:31:16 AM
In all seriousness, BRD, I agree.  I have a haunting feeling that Frenchtown is already looking at the "big picture". I can see the City wanting to 'annex' the Stewart Road Property as they will most likely lose a Top-5 employer and be stuck with a huge drop in Property Tax revenue.

The entire tie-in of Mall Road to the "Health Care Corridor" does make sense.

All this is happening not too far from the Chateau Debimark......good thing, as the ambulance ride isn't too far in the event of a Fifty Shades Duct Tape accident, or worse, a zip-tie malfunction.

If I become a Developer, I shall have to hire you as a Consultant in the areas of "Planning, Forecasting, Coffee and Distilled Spirit Connoisseur". Something is happening out there, and I expect an announcement any day. The LZB Building will make that the "it" place to be. I expect some minor developments including some sub shops, a party store, and maybe a small franchise for dining.

I see mammoth opportunities for development and investment, not to mention property prices going through the roof. I think now I know why the owner of that ratty old Car Wash held out for so long.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 25, 2015, 08:38:29 AM
In all seriousness, BRD, I agree.  I have a haunting feeling that Frenchtown is already looking at the "big picture". I can see the City wanting to 'annex' the Stewart Road Property as they will most likely lose a Top-5 employer and be stuck with a huge drop in Property Tax revenue.

The entire tie-in of Mall Road to the "Health Care Corridor" does make sense.

All this is happening not too far from the Chateau Debimark......good thing, as the ambulance ride isn't too far in the event of a Fifty Shades Duct Tape accident, or worse, a zip-tie malfunction.

If I become a Developer, I shall have to hire you as a Consultant in the areas of "Planning, Forecasting, Coffee and Distilled Spirit Connoisseur". Something is happening out there, and I expect an announcement any day. The LZB Building will make that the "it" place to be. I expect some minor developments including some sub shops, a party store, and maybe a small franchise for dining.

I see mammoth opportunities for development and investment, not to mention property prices going through the roof. I think now I know why the owner of that ratty old Car Wash held out for so long.


That was his 'retirement' plan:

(http://yetundedaramola.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Gold-Mine.jpg)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 25, 2015, 08:47:01 AM
In all seriousness, BRD, I agree.  I have a haunting feeling that Frenchtown is already looking at the "big picture". I can see the City wanting to 'annex' the Stewart Road Property as they will most likely lose a Top-5 employer and be stuck with a huge drop in Property Tax revenue.

The entire tie-in of Mall Road to the "Health Care Corridor" does make sense.

All this is happening not too far from the Chateau Debimark......good thing, as the ambulance ride isn't too far in the event of a Fifty Shades Duct Tape accident, or worse, a zip-tie malfunction.

If I become a Developer, I shall have to hire you as a Consultant in the areas of "Planning, Forecasting, Coffee and Distilled Spirit Connoisseur". Something is happening out there, and I expect an announcement any day. The LZB Building will make that the "it" place to be. I expect some minor developments including some sub shops, a party store, and maybe a small franchise for dining.

I see mammoth opportunities for development and investment, not to mention property prices going through the roof. I think now I know why the owner of that ratty old Car Wash held out for so long.

Quatro has been talking for a few years now about doing something similar on his corner...   a development like you've proposed would tie right in with what he's wanting to do. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Professor H on February 27, 2015, 01:07:33 PM
I see Northland Mall in Detroit has been ordered to close... 

must have been a bankruptcy thing as a judge was involved.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: rands on March 04, 2015, 12:02:06 PM
Well, believe it if you will, but I was told by a long time Mercy employee, no a PreMedica employee, the plans are already in the works for a new hospital, probably back on Stewart Rd o hospital owned property.  Dont laugh, because ProMedica is already going to build a new hospital outside of Adrian, closing Tecumseh and Adrians hospital, combining them into 1

If I remember correctly, about 3 or so years ago the MEN had an article on Mercy Hospital .  It was mentioned that in 2016 or 2017 they were planning to build a new hospital on Stewart Rd.  Maybe Promedica is going to speed things up?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on March 04, 2015, 03:17:43 PM
Guessing it will be at least that long.   Promedica already has a new admin campus in downtown Toledo and a new Lenawee County hospital to replace Bixby and Herrick in the works.   Guessing they would want to get those major projects done before starting another.   If you heard the remarks when the merger announcement was made, it was pretty clear Promedica will be making a major investment in Monroe though.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 04, 2015, 03:52:58 PM
Guessing it will be at least that long.   Promedica already has a new admin campus in downtown Toledo and a new Lenawee County hospital to replace Bixby and Herrick in the works.   Guessing they would want to get those major projects done before starting another.   If you heard the remarks when the merger announcement was made, it was pretty clear Promedica will be making a major investment in Monroe though.


I just posted a photo of the big building project they're in the middle of down in Sylvania too:

http://monroetalks.com/forum/index.php?topic=30364.msg690799;topicseen#msg690799 (http://monroetalks.com/forum/index.php?topic=30364.msg690799;topicseen#msg690799)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Flanders on March 04, 2015, 04:23:42 PM
Mall of Monroe + http://www.icombat.com/ (http://www.icombat.com/) = WIN!!

Yes, it's laser tag for adults.  Yes, that is a shock belt you wear to "feel" the experience.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: The Fuzz on March 04, 2015, 04:32:21 PM
I've done that before and it is a RIOT!

The mall is too big though, the 2 that I have been in would be no larger than the area JCP used to occupy.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: rands on March 04, 2015, 07:45:14 PM
I wonder if they could work out a deal with contractor who is building the new hospital in Lenawee County, build two identical hospitals.  They may be able to reduce the cost on both.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 05, 2015, 07:35:18 AM
I've done that before and it is a RIOT!

The mall is too big though, the 2 that I have been in would be no larger than the area JCP used to occupy.

For something like this wouldn't the just closed 'Target' store be sort of appropriate then ??? ??? ???
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: livewire on March 05, 2015, 07:44:05 AM
Looking at the cost per square foot, I don't see how laser tag would be able to afford such a place. 

That's a LOT of area to pay for, even if we're just talking about the Target location.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 05, 2015, 07:50:28 AM
Looking at the cost per square foot, I don't see how laser tag would be able to afford such a place. 

That's a LOT of area to pay for, even if we're just talking about the Target location.

It would probably be like everything else that goes in out there...

first few days it would be packed...

next few months they'd have quite a bit of traffic...

and after that it would only be the 'die hards' still using it :( :( :(
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: The Fuzz on March 05, 2015, 07:55:48 AM
Yea......just like my limited exposure of doing it a few times, chances are I'd go back once or twice if it was local.  The last one I went to I believe was just outside of Ann Arbor and it was packed.......really popular with young kids though.  Wasn't cheap either.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Billy on March 06, 2015, 10:02:08 AM
Although I'd support any business that gave the areas kids something to do. I'd have to agree with Fuzz.

It's one of those things I'd do once or twice and probably never return.

I used to be a big paintball guy and that's what happened to most of the smaller fields. They'd be packed for the first few months and after that they'd struggle to have enough players to stage a game. Eventually we just cashed it in and would drive all the way to the Hamburgh area to play at Hell's Survivors. Talk about a riot.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: The Fuzz on March 06, 2015, 10:56:06 AM
LOL.....big paint baller here too, Billy.  Have been since the mid-90's.

Great spots to go jump in on a game.....I used to go up to that place outside of Walled Lake.

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Professor H on March 06, 2015, 05:42:32 PM
Paintball was a great thing to play with co-workers...   

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: The Fuzz on March 06, 2015, 06:03:28 PM
LOL....yup, we did a "team building" event like that once with Program Managers taking on the General Managers of our manufacturing divisions.  A total hoot that did bring us together on a different level outside of our work relationships.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Billy on March 07, 2015, 08:07:28 AM
I don't know if you still play but if you do I suggest you check out the Tippman World Challenge played at Hells Survivor paintball field in Hamburgh. Haven't been in a few years but it used to draw 3,500/4,000 players using authentic military vehicles. Used to go down in mid or end of September.

http://hellsurvivors.com/tippmann/index.php (http://hellsurvivors.com/tippmann/index.php)

There are lot's of images and a ton of crappy YT videos out there if you want to check it out. The play field is 180 acres so pictures don't do it any justice.

http://hellsurvivors.com/index_page/fieldmap.php (http://hellsurvivors.com/index_page/fieldmap.php)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: The Fuzz on March 07, 2015, 10:11:59 AM
Been there for those in the past.....last time was about 5 years or so when it occurred to me that men in their mid-50's are not quite up to the vigor level played on that field.  I play with a younger group of guys around here and we call ourselves "The First Cajun Calvary".......I have the yell down pat.  LMAO.

I've played events at the old Mansfield Prison site, and a really neat field just across the Indiana state line off of I-94.  I LOVE that field.....great set up except for the entry points where I came to understand what the Allied invasion of Normandy must have been like.   ;D

The young guys always take care of me......and have somewhat built our strategy on the accuracy of my Tippman as a sniper in our little ambush strategy.

I love the overnight events......setting up camps, cooking, preparing for the next day, and obviously the party portion of it.

 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Billy on March 07, 2015, 10:23:49 AM
Quote
I love the overnight events......setting up camps, cooking, preparing for the next day, and obviously the party portion of it.

 

Amen brother! Good times. I played heavy pre- left knee/ leg destruction and most of us were late 20's early thirties. Ended up taking everyones  kids and half the damn neighborhood with us. Good thing was they'd be so worn out from the game we'd get our party on. I probably couldn't handle either these days.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on March 07, 2015, 10:40:26 AM
Never been to the mall that I know of.  I was so sick of having to run to Monroe for everything to do with licenses courts etc I would never go for pleasure.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 08, 2015, 01:24:33 PM
Here's a question for the long time shoppers at the mall...

Which stores are still there from day one?

I know for sure 'none of the original' anchors have made it!!!

Was Mrs. Fields there from day one?  I know their counter used to be diagonally across and part of where the just closed Hallmark store was...  but it faced the food court!  I remember that from about 1990 but can't recall before that.  If so then obviously that would be the only food court store to survive.

I'm weaker on the retail stores though...   I know at one time there were four jewelry stores and now down to two...  were they both original tenants? 

Has Claire's been there 'forever'?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 04, 2018, 11:32:27 AM
Here's a question for the long time shoppers at the mall...

Which stores are still there from day one?

I know for sure 'none of the original' anchors have made it!!!

Was Mrs. Fields there from day one?  I know their counter used to be diagonally across and part of where the just closed Hallmark store was...  but it faced the food court!  I remember that from about 1990 but can't recall before that.  If so then obviously that would be the only food court store to survive.

I'm weaker on the retail stores though...   I know at one time there were four jewelry stores and now down to two...  were they both original tenants? 

Has Claire's been there 'forever'?

I'm still trying to sort these out if anyone happens to remember!
Title: Mall of Monroe... Is this the answer to it's survival and maybe even growth?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 04, 2018, 11:46:55 AM
The mall here is not the only one that is struggling for survival.  We've watched a couple in Toledo close and actually get torn down for different uses.

This study discusses adding residential housing units to the mix of mall tenants. 

I would guess that would mean putting residential units in the now empty Sears store and the former Target store.  A note on Target that is probably unique to many or most malls around the country.  Target owns or did own their own building and also the land in front, back and to the south.  That is why the mall built a 'wall' at the former entrance to the target store and there is not one at the entrance to the former Sears store.

It this actually took off I could see the potential to even build some free standing units on some of the other undeveloped property that the mall owns surrounding the mall.  Applebees is actually on mall property and the whole stretch along mall road is completely vacant.

Reading the article below it indicates a major 'key' is entertainment.  There is at least a popular theater already in the mix.  My own logic says a mix of restaurants would have to follow.  Maybe that's why Olga's looks ready to open up again tomorrow morning!

A big plus I would think is that the former hospital had already started some various housing development on the property adjacent to the Target side of the property.

Is this why the mall was taken off the market so suddenly?

Maybe someone is in the process of negotiating with Target and Cafaro...

I would think it would have to be a situation of all or nothing.

http://www.oncommonground-digital.org/oncommonground/winter_2018__the_new_neighborhood/MobilePagedArticle.action?articleId=1263811&app=false#articleId1263811 (http://www.oncommonground-digital.org/oncommonground/winter_2018__the_new_neighborhood/MobilePagedArticle.action?articleId=1263811&app=false#articleId1263811)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on February 04, 2018, 08:17:06 PM
The Bon Ton bought Elder Beerman (the whole company, not the location) and eventually changed the name of this location to another of their brands, Carsons so technically they've made it this far.   However bankruptcy is imminent and it doesn't look good for a turnaround.

Taco Bell has been there but moved for the theater expansion.   The bookstore has been in that location since the beginning but started as Waldenbooks which was owned by Borders.   BAM bought a few locations in bankruptcy.   Mastercuts is another original but moved.   I think the jewelry stores too.  The community room is original and there are are few spaces that have never in close to 30 years had a tenant.

I too suspect something is up with the property being taken off the market.   Also doesn't make a lot of sense that the theater sunk so much money into their location without something being up.  They just in the last week listed the old Sears space for lease.   I know sometimes when stores like that close the tenant continues to pay the lease for the rest of term and it doesn't get released.   Perhaps the original lease just expired?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on February 05, 2018, 08:21:08 AM
Malls are out of style now.  I don't see any surviving over the long run.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 05, 2018, 12:32:34 PM
The Bon Ton bought Elder Beerman (the whole company, not the location) and eventually changed the name of this location to another of their brands, Carsons so technically they've made it this far.  However bankruptcy is imminent and it doesn't look good for a turnaround.

Taco Bell has been there but moved for the theater expansion.   The bookstore has been in that location since the beginning but started as Waldenbooks which was owned by Borders.   BAM bought a few locations in bankruptcy.   Mastercuts is another original but moved.   I think the jewelry stores too.  The community room is original and there are are few spaces that have never in close to 30 years had a tenant.

I too suspect something is up with the property being taken off the market.   Also doesn't make a lot of sense that the theater sunk so much money into their location without something being up.  They just in the last week listed the old Sears space for lease.   I know sometimes when stores like that close the tenant continues to pay the lease for the rest of term and it doesn't get released.   Perhaps the original lease just expired?

They filed this morning in Delaware. 

Interesting that Bon Ton is now trending on Twitter!

https://twitter.com/search?f=tweets&vertical=news&q=%22Bon-Ton%20Stores%22&src=tren
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on February 05, 2018, 01:20:37 PM
Competing with Internet retailers is basically impossible for any brick and mortar retailer.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 05, 2018, 07:49:36 PM
Competing with Internet retailers is basically impossible for any brick and mortar retailer.

So switch to being a service provider!

Malls are out of style now.  I don't see any surviving over the long run.

If they convert one to a primarily housing unit then I don't think it would be considered a mall anymore.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on February 05, 2018, 08:22:41 PM
I still go to the mall when I want something.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Monroe Native on February 05, 2018, 08:38:24 PM
If they convert one to a primarily housing unit then I don't think it would be considered a mall anymore.

Wouldn't it be the "walk-able" mixed used development that all the professional planners pretend everyone wants to live in?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 06, 2018, 08:34:12 AM
Wouldn't it be the "walk-able" mixed used development that all the professional planners pretend everyone wants to live in?

I would say it's a near perfect example. 

As far as the planners...    they can pretend all they want but if someone builds a community (of any plan) and no one buys or rents then that planner is probably not going to get a lot of work in the future!

It's definitely not the type of community I'm ready to move into at this point in my life.

5-10-15 years down the road that might change though. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on February 06, 2018, 09:47:36 AM
I don't have any ideas of moving to mixed use developments.  I like my own property and just me doing what i want putzing around in the yard, weather permitting of course..  If i get bored i go somewhere.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 06, 2018, 10:11:51 AM
I don't have any ideas of moving to mixed use developments.  I like my own property and just me doing what i want putzing around in the yard, weather permitting of course..  If i get bored i go somewhere.

This is another case of generational differences and younger people expecting instant gratification.  They don't want to drive to the mall.  They want to walk and be there in 3 minutes!!!
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on February 06, 2018, 10:38:10 AM
Not just younger people.  Those mixed use developments are popular with empty nester professional types as well.    They like being able to walk a block to dinner, entertainment, coffee shops, etc too.   Many have grown tired of taking care of the big house, yard, etc and want more time for themselves while also at a point in their career where they have taken on a lot of responsibility.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on February 06, 2018, 10:52:22 AM
One more thing...most of those mixed use developments look nothing like a mall.   They look more like downtowns.   Apartments and offices above, retail, resturants, and offices on the ground floors.   Sounds a lot like what a lot of people are trying to do in downtown Monroe.   Don't think we can support both.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 06, 2018, 01:14:48 PM
Not just younger people.  Those mixed use developments are popular with empty nester professional types as well.    They like being able to walk a block to dinner, entertainment, coffee shops, etc too.   Many have grown tired of taking care of the big house, yard, etc and want more time for themselves while also at a point in their career where they have taken on a lot of responsibility.

My wife and I qualify as the 'empty nesters' unless you count the dog!

However, where we don't fit the rest of this group is we still love working in our garden and yard.

Yes, it would be nice to have multiple restaurants (even driving we seldom go to the same restaurant two times in a row) within walking distance but you truly can't have everything.

One potential downside I see is that even a married couple living (and potentially also working) in one of these settings would no longer need two vehicles. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 06, 2018, 01:20:33 PM
One more thing...most of those mixed use developments look nothing like a mall.   They look more like downtowns.   Apartments and offices above, retail, resturants, and offices on the ground floors.   Sounds a lot like what a lot of people are trying to do in downtown Monroe.   Don't think we can support both.

That could make for an interesting study!

Anyone have any figures on the numbers of currently 'built out' units there are downtown and then how many more are there potentially if every building was finished to 100% occupancy? 

The current mall has the potential to add a lot of units to the area. 

The downtown area has the river as a potential draw but so many of the buildings are still old.  You can put a lot of lipstick on them but when it's all done they're still old.  I know some of that is 'charm' but...

The mall would have the capacity for everything to be new!
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on February 06, 2018, 01:51:01 PM
Here's an article on 'shared living' and how it's still around after the recession.  This certainly may have some future impact on where people choose to live...

yes, 'even in Monroe'!

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/thank-you-for-being-a-friend-and-for-paying-the-rent-2018-01-31 (https://www.marketwatch.com/story/thank-you-for-being-a-friend-and-for-paying-the-rent-2018-01-31)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on February 06, 2018, 02:18:50 PM
One potential downside I see is that even a married couple living (and potentially also working) in one of these settings would no longer need two vehicles. 

Definitely.  With more and more professional types telecommuting its conceivable that even in Monroe with one spouse commuting north or south, you could live with 1 car easily.   In the rare case you need 2, Enterprise will pick you up for probably way less than owning a second.   And there's Uber here now too.   
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Tea Party Patriot on February 08, 2018, 10:19:24 AM
I don't have any ideas of moving to mixed use developments.  I like my own property and just me doing what i want putzing around in the yard, weather permitting of course..  If i get bored i go somewhere.
He said it would be built in 5-10 years so you don't matter.If you arent dead your kids will have you put in a home by then anyway,
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Monroe Native on February 08, 2018, 08:31:43 PM
The mixed use concept is great if you want to live in close quarters with other happy people.

The older I get, and the more dysfunctional that things seem to get - the more I want to live far, far, away from the masses of humanity.

They can be in their happy village, I'll take the wide open spaces and take care of myself.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on February 08, 2018, 10:05:27 PM
He said it would be built in 5-10 years so you don't matter.If you arent dead your kids will have you put in a home by then anyway,

Well it really doesn't matter because mainly it's in that shithole Monroe Mi,
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Monroe Native on February 09, 2018, 07:11:11 PM
Well it really doesn't matter because mainly it's in that shithole Monroe Mi,

Well said.

+1
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: The Fuzz on February 10, 2018, 04:04:11 PM
The mixed use concept is great if you want to live in close quarters with other happy people.

The older I get, and the more dysfunctional that things seem to get - the more I want to live far, far, away from the masses of humanity.

They can be in their happy village, I'll take the wide open spaces and take care of myself.

I'm with ya to a large degree.  I am healthy enough to take care of most things that come my way, and still active in outdoor activities around the house.

The last few years me and my siblings have been dealing with our Mother's dementia and becoming physically unable to care for herself for any duration at a time exceeding 10 minutes......of course that is the extreme part in the circle of life. 

I can see a transition period for me should I be fortunate to live that long where I could spend several years in an environment for that.  It comes down to personal needs.....I think it could be a good development idea.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 10, 2018, 08:59:58 AM
Quote
Mall jewelry chain Claire's Stores is reportedly tumbling toward bankruptcy protection, aiming to polish off its finances and reemerge with a brighter future.

Quote
The chain is expected to file for bankruptcy "in the coming weeks," Bloomberg reported, citing confidential sources. Claire's had 3,291 stores worldwide as of Oct. 28, including 653 franchised locations.

https://www.freep.com/story/money/2018/03/09/claires-bankruptcy/411182002/ (https://www.freep.com/story/money/2018/03/09/claires-bankruptcy/411182002/)


Does anyone know if the store here in Monroe is a franchise or a company store?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on March 11, 2018, 09:33:37 AM
I had the opportunity to walk around the mall this weekend.   I see no reason to ever go back.   One thing that stood out to me, both FYE and Bath and Body Works stores look very dated compared to their stores I've seen in other malls.   I'd be willing to bet they are just riding out their leases.  I didn't walk all the way down but it looked like Claire's was having a garage sale or something.   Hallmark had several bare spots, maybe they are in the process of rolling out spring?    Carsons had a lot of bare-looking racks and shelves from what I saw just walking by.    The only thing busy...ok, the only thing with more than 1-2 customers, was the theater and the play place where Old Navy was.   That place was actually packed.   Good for them!

Good thing we didn't get the one-time-proposed ToysRUs.   Or was that proposed on Telegraph?

I have to believe the days are numbered. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Professor H on March 11, 2018, 10:14:15 AM
I had the opportunity to walk around the mall this weekend.   I see no reason to ever go back.   One thing that stood out to me, both FYE and Bath and Body Works stores look very dated compared to their stores I've seen in other malls.   I'd be willing to bet they are just riding out their leases.  I didn't walk all the way down but it looked like Claire's was having a garage sale or something.   Hallmark had several bare spots, maybe they are in the process of rolling out spring?    Carsons had a lot of bare-looking racks and shelves from what I saw just walking by.    The only thing busy...ok, the only thing with more than 1-2 customers, was the theater and the play place where Old Navy was.   That place was actually packed.   Good for them!

Good thing we didn't get the one-time-proposed ToysRUs.   Or was that proposed on Telegraph?

I have to believe the days are numbered. 

I'm guessing they have a plan to seal off the area from the Theatre section when they decide to no longer heat the vast open areas...   Carsons could make it as a stand alone possibly -  can't think of anything else thats left worth keeping that heating bill going...     The rent of a mall vs a standalone has actually made downtowns and strip malls look more viable to new businesses.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 11, 2018, 10:17:56 AM
I had the opportunity to walk around the mall this weekend.   I see no reason to ever go back.   One thing that stood out to me, both FYE and Bath and Body Works stores look very dated compared to their stores I've seen in other malls.   I'd be willing to bet they are just riding out their leases. I didn't walk all the way down but it looked like Claire's was having a garage sale or something.   Hallmark had several bare spots, maybe they are in the process of rolling out spring?    Carsons had a lot of bare-looking racks and shelves from what I saw just walking by.    The only thing busy...ok, the only thing with more than 1-2 customers, was the theater and the play place where Old Navy was.   That place was actually packed.   Good for them!

Good thing we didn't get the one-time-proposed ToysRUs.   Or was that proposed on Telegraph?

I have to believe the days are numbered.

I was out there walking yesterday afternoon. 

A girl scout troop had a table of cookies for sale so we bought some of those.  Nice to see a little variety 8) 8) 8)

I had to laugh out loud at your 'garage sale' comment. 

They've been 'hanging out' for quite some time now.  I don't know if that's additional square footage they're using of if they've just pushed some of their regular displays out there to make them more 'visible' from the food court :-\ :-\ :-\

Some of the clerks really push the displays out there and some are a little more conservative.

When I'm walking it makes for some interesting twists and turns sometimes.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 11, 2018, 10:50:26 AM
Claire's does seem to have something going on most of the time and I'm out there at very odd times.  I see a young girl getting her ears pierced just about every time I'm out there.  Some are a lot of fun to watch and some of them almost make me cry! 

As opposed to the next door GNC store which even with their in mall competition gone is still pretty slow most of the time.   
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on March 13, 2018, 09:02:40 AM
Not looking good for Bon Ton (Carsons).   A group of creditors is bidding with a liquidator to immediately liquidate all assets.   The company and some vendors are trying to put together a bid to save about 150 of the 260 remaining stores but need financing and only have 3 weeks to do so.   Sounds like the best case is another 110 stores are closing.     
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on March 14, 2018, 08:43:39 AM
Mall don't matter to CL and I at all.  We have never been there and don't plan on ever going.  Don't like crowds anyway.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Monroe Native on March 14, 2018, 10:11:53 AM
Mall don't matter to CL and I at all.  We have never been there and don't plan on ever going.  Don't like crowds anyway.

If you don't like crowds - the Mall of Monroe is the place for you!

 ;D
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 14, 2018, 01:55:01 PM
If you don't like crowds - the Mall of Monroe is the place for you!

 ;D

There's an old saying:

(https://cdn.someecards.com/someecards/usercards/walking-aint-crowded--f5704.png)

you can just add 'at the Mall of Monroe' 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on March 15, 2018, 05:52:37 AM
If you don't like crowds - the Mall of Monroe is the place for you!

 ;D

Candidly, I don't even know where it is.  Monroe has never been one of my 'to go to' places.  I only go there when absolutely necessary.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Professor H on March 19, 2018, 11:27:53 AM
I see Claires has filed Chapter 11...   so the garage sale wlll grow at the mall until they are evicted for not paying their lease...
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 19, 2018, 03:17:40 PM
I see Claires has filed Chapter 11...   so the garage sale wlll grow at the mall until they are evicted for not paying their lease...

The article I read a week or so ago predicted they should come out of this and still be fairly strong.  Their earnings have been up at almost all of their locations so it was just a matter of getting rid of some costly debt which the Chapter 11 should do. 

I guess only time will tell.

Personally, I don't shop their myself ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on March 19, 2018, 05:19:25 PM
Yeah, just read an article a minute ago that says they have no plans for mass store closings but do predict to shrink by about a few hundred locations in the next 4 years.    I'd bet Monroe is one of those sooner or later.   Maybe their decision, maybe the landlords.   
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Monroe Native on March 19, 2018, 06:07:21 PM
Candidly, I don't even know where it is.  Monroe has never been one of my 'to go to' places.  I only go there when absolutely necessary.

There isn't much reason to come here.

I just went to 4 businesses after work today.

One of them didn't know about the appointment they had made with me, but then said they would take care of it, please wait.  I left after sitting 50 minutes with no one saying anything to me, but listening to the person who made the mistake complain to other employees about it.

The second I sat in a line for a car wash for five minutes and it wasn't moving - so I left.  As I pulled around it there was one of the employees having a nice conversation with someone on the other end, and they gave me a dirty look as I went past them - there wasn't much space.

The third had a sign on the window saying sorry - out for a few minutes.  Uhhhhhh - when did that start?  When are you going to be back?  Sorry if I don't sit here waiting for you to come on back.

The fourth - good service.  Thanks Brent for making a key for me.  Charged way more than Lowes would have, but got it done.

Krogers - half the gas pumps had out of order bags on them.  Seriously?  Found a pump and got gas though.  Thanks to the nice lady in the F150 that looked up from her phone just in time to not hit me.  Not sure what was on the glowing screen that was so important - but probably better to look where your vehicle is going instead of your phone.

Not a good batting average of businesses ready to make money if you ask me.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on March 19, 2018, 06:55:26 PM
I will never buy Kroger gas again and I've instructed Amy not too either.  She filled up her buggy at the one on M50 in Dundee (I was with her).  We got about 2 miles from the station and the engine started missing and the check engine light came on.

I thought right away..  bad gas.  It's taken me a couple bottles of B12 Chem Tool and dry gas to get the water out.  Never again. Swill gas.  Cheap is nice but water isn't.  Must have been old gas in as much as alcohol attracts water or someone peed in the tank...
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on March 19, 2018, 08:12:07 PM
You think it's the gas they received or maybe water got into their tanks..

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 20, 2018, 08:23:03 AM
I will never buy Kroger gas again and I've instructed Amy not too either.  She filled up her buggy at the one on M50 in Dundee (I was with her).  We got about 2 miles from the station and the engine started missing and the check engine light came on.

I thought right away..  bad gas.  It's taken me a couple bottles of B12 Chem Tool and dry gas to get the water out.  Never again. Swill gas.  Cheap is nice but water isn't.  Must have been old gas in as much as alcohol attracts water or someone peed in the tank...

What did the store manager say when you explained it to them?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on March 20, 2018, 09:16:29 AM
You think it's the gas they received or maybe water got into their tanks..

Don't know but e-gas attracts water anyway.  All tanks have water in the bottom, even diesel tanks.  The ones we had the garage had water in the bottom, couple inches.  The tank monitors (if they work correctly) monitor the water level and if the water was excessive you added a dispersant or sucked it out.

Could be that they just has a fuel drop and it stirred up the water, why I prefer to get gas (or diesel) long after a fuel drop.  When I drove for Nitrex in Cleveland and we dropped fuel, we always 'sticked' the tanks prior to, to check the sump water level.  Tank sticks (even today) have a coating on them that indicates the water level in the bottom.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on March 20, 2018, 09:23:17 AM
What did the store manager say when you explained it to them?

Never said anything.  I don't expect a pump jockey/ fuel attendant to know about tank monitors anyway.  The new electronic ones are just a bank of red and green LED's.  Green is good, red isn't but you have to 'look' at them and that is asking alot from a fuel jockey.

Like I said, all tanks have water in the bottom.  Fact of life.  The dropped fuel is warm, the tank is cold do you get condensation and moisture drop out.  It occurs more in the winter than the summer.  If the delivery driver uses the indicator stick (if), they know where the sump water level is and can add dispersants to mitigate it...  I say if and thats a big if.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 20, 2018, 12:26:03 PM
What did the store manager say when you explained it to them?

Never said anything.  I don't expect a pump jockey/ fuel attendant to know about tank monitors anyway.  The new electronic ones are just a bank of red and green LED's.  Green is good, red isn't but you have to 'look' at them and that is asking alot from a fuel jockey.

Like I said, all tanks have water in the bottom.  Fact of life.  The dropped fuel is warm, the tank is cold do you get condensation and moisture drop out.  It occurs more in the winter than the summer.  If the delivery driver uses the indicator stick (if), they know where the sump water level is and can add dispersants to mitigate it...  I say if and thats a big if.


A major, major difference between the store manager and the fuel clerk.
The fuel clerk is frequently at the very bottom of the scale in a store...  short of the bagger maybe.

Their major job is to sell cigarettes and bottled drinks and maybe a package of gum along with take care of cash customers. 


What you haven't said is where you are going to buy your fuel now. 

I assume some place that has 'zero' chance of getting water into the tank ;) ;) ;)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on March 20, 2018, 01:08:00 PM
Yeah, wth is going on at the Monroe St. Kroger?   I bet 1/3+ of the pumps have bags on the handles as of yesterday.   Some have been out of order since last week.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 20, 2018, 02:19:32 PM
Yeah, wth is going on at the Monroe St. Kroger?   I bet 1/3+ of the pumps have bags on the handles as of yesterday.   Some have been out of order since last week.


Although Kroger does most of their in-store maintenance themselves everything at the Fuel Center is done by an outside contractor (I assume for liability). 

Oscar Larson is who does most of the work in this area.

http://www.larsonco.com/ (http://www.larsonco.com/)

There can be any number of reasons they'll 'bag' a pump.  The pump may be literally just not working due to many reasons.  There can be a leak in the nozzle or hose or a fitting down lower. 

Every once in a while a customer even forgets the nozzle is still in the fuel filler and decides to just 'drive off'!!!

The hoses do have a 'break away' coupling but sometimes things can get nasty and even catch fire!!!

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 21, 2018, 08:20:12 AM
Getting back to the mall...

There's some effort going on to resurrect KB-Toys to fill the void of the Toys-R-Gone stores.

Probably too wild to even imagine a KB Toys store in the mall again!!!

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/after-toys-r-us-another-defunct-toymaker-plots-comeback/ (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/after-toys-r-us-another-defunct-toymaker-plots-comeback/)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on March 21, 2018, 10:11:48 AM
From what I've read in Crain's, there will be a lot of toy manufacturers going tits up with Toys R Us.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 22, 2018, 08:53:48 AM
Yeah, wth is going on at the Monroe St. Kroger?   I bet 1/3+ of the pumps have bags on the handles as of yesterday.   Some have been out of order since last week.

We had to run to Kroger last night so I swung through the fuel center as we were going in and leaving.  Didn't see a single yellow bag anywhere.  All pumps appeared ready to go.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on March 28, 2018, 09:03:59 PM
We were out north of town this afternoon so I decided to just go walk at the mall. 

When I turned the corner and could see down toward Claire's I noticed there weren't any of the recent displays setting out in the walking area.  Then when I got down there the gate was almost down to the floor and the place was almost empty.  A couple of people in there finishing up packing a few boxes but other than that the place is cleaned out.  I guess they'll be 'long gone' by the end of the month.

If anyone knows Gracie that worked there tell her I said 'HI'!

I haven't seen her the last several times I've been there to walk.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on April 04, 2018, 08:07:33 AM
Bids for Bon Ton are due today.   Liquidators vs a partnership of 2 mall owners.

Mall owners Namdar, Washington Prime in bid to buy Bon-Ton: sources (https://www.reuters.com/article/us-bon-ton-stores-m-a-wa-prime/mall-owners-namdar-washington-prime-in-bid-to-buy-bon-ton-sources-idUSKCN1HA2MP)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 04, 2018, 10:26:46 PM
Malls in general are a thing of the past.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on April 05, 2018, 09:56:38 AM
I think so.  Maybe the only ones that survice are the 6 and 7 unit neighborhood type.  Bigger stuff people go to the big boxes or mail order
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 05, 2018, 10:07:40 AM
Malls in general are a thing of the past.

They're a fantastic place to go walk in a controlled environment 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on April 07, 2018, 07:49:44 AM
Yesterday afternoon Bon Ton sent out WARN notices for a complete shutdown by June but said there's still a chance the company could be rescued. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 07, 2018, 08:40:30 AM
Yesterday afternoon Bon Ton sent out WARN notices for a complete shutdown by June but said there's still a chance the company could be rescued.

There's always a chance I'll win the lottery too...

but the odds are against it?

So, how long can a mall go without an anchor?

Is the theater considered and anchor...   

it certainly has drawing power but how much more will those people actually spend while they're there?

How many even go beyond the theater itself?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Monroe Native on April 07, 2018, 09:46:06 AM
How many even go beyond the theater itself?

I don't even go to that theater.

If I want to watch a movie on a big TV on a LaZBoy I can do that at home.

If I want to see a moving on the "big screen" you have to leave Monroe.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 07, 2018, 09:49:05 AM
I don't even go to that theater.

If I want to watch a movie on a big TV on a LaZBoy I can do that at home.

If I want to see a moving on the "big screen" you have to leave Monroe.

Both good points however the theater still seems to be by far the biggest draw at the mall. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 10, 2018, 09:25:18 AM
Closing announcements have started for Michigan...

I wonder how long before we know what is happening in Monroe?

https://www.clickondetroit.com/consumer/3-carsons-1-younkers-store-to-close-in-michigan-in-june (https://www.clickondetroit.com/consumer/3-carsons-1-younkers-store-to-close-in-michigan-in-june)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on April 10, 2018, 09:52:48 AM
A lot of talk about how great Amazon and other net retailers are.  Forcing a lot of locals to close.  There are going to be a lot of people unemployed.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: nails on April 10, 2018, 03:39:45 PM

Honestly . . . the demise of the Mom & Pop smaller retailers began with Walmart.

And you can probably throw Home Depot, and Lowes into that group that killed small hardware stores.

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on April 10, 2018, 05:18:34 PM
Online retail is only about 10% of the market and a lot of the brick and mortar retailers have a piece of that.   Its just an excuse to cover up the fact that investors scooped them up, massively loaded them with debt, took the cash, and ran.

And it probably started with Kmart and other defunct 60's discount retailers.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 17, 2018, 11:36:20 AM
BonTon is down to the wire and the only serious bidders have been liquidator companies...

that is going to open up a lot more 'available' space at the mall.

http://buffalonews.com/2018/04/17/bon-ton-stores-will-likely-close-liquidate-all-stores/ (http://buffalonews.com/2018/04/17/bon-ton-stores-will-likely-close-liquidate-all-stores/)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on April 17, 2018, 09:11:16 PM
Its official.   CEO announced tonight they'll be gone in 10-12 weeks.

http://www.toledoblade.com/Retail/2018/04/17/BREAKING-Elder-Beerman-likely-going-out-of-business-without-bid-from-buyer.html (http://www.toledoblade.com/Retail/2018/04/17/BREAKING-Elder-Beerman-likely-going-out-of-business-without-bid-from-buyer.html)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on April 18, 2018, 09:49:56 AM
Just heard FYE is closing too.   Kay is moving to a to-be-built building on Telegraph next to Walmart.    I have to believe the interior of the mall will be shutting down in pretty short order.   
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 18, 2018, 09:56:39 AM
People are generally stupid..  If you don't support any store by purchasing their goods, sooner or later they go tits up.  People whine about closings (A national past time, whining) but don't do anything to keep them in business.

Stupid is as stupid does to borrow a Forrest Gump line.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on April 18, 2018, 10:07:33 AM
I guess I'm told old to order all my stuff on the net.  I do get some but for the most part i go to a store.
And when i need hardware stuff i go to lambertville hardware.  Yeah some things might cost a little more but i like the service and convenience it provides.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on April 18, 2018, 03:39:48 PM
Lambertville is great.   Wish Monroe had something decent like that.   Ace on Dixe is great but the hours suck for working folk.   Ace on Stewart is condescending and usually you end up at Lowes to get everything you need anyway so why bother?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 18, 2018, 09:49:34 PM
The Ace on Dixie is actually Baker Welding and I get my welding equipment and consumables from them.  It's a nice store.  I agree, the hours are a bit for a working stiff but it's more of an industry supplier than a homeowner shop.  Just like Fastenal and Parker by Magnum Force.  they all cater to the industrial buyer and small business owner..  Home Despot and Lowes are more about the homeowner and have the hours for that.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 19, 2018, 12:20:49 PM
Just watching the 13ABC Toledo noon news while we eat lunch. 

They were just discussing the BonTon related closings and some of the impact locally.  They also mentioned that so far 'retail space' closings are occurring at a record pace for 2018.  I'll watch their website later and see if they have a link to that anywhere.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 19, 2018, 06:47:02 PM
The sales start tomorrow!

http://nbc24.com/news/local/bon-ton-stores-announce-going-out-of-business-locations (http://nbc24.com/news/local/bon-ton-stores-announce-going-out-of-business-locations)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 20, 2018, 08:04:20 AM
I'd say the 'Mall' is getting closer and closer to the demolition ball.  Malls are out of fashion anyway.  The idea hatched in the late 50 and early 60's has run it's course.  Time to move on...
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on April 20, 2018, 09:48:07 AM
I have a feeling it will sit closed off for a long, long time.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: The Fuzz on April 20, 2018, 09:49:57 AM
Yes......just like the old LZBOY building.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Professor H on April 20, 2018, 12:18:44 PM
Gee maybe that's where Harbor Freight will move into... 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on April 20, 2018, 01:01:45 PM
Here's the current situation.

Carson's            Closing
Carson's Home Store      Closing
f.y.e.             Closing
Kay Jewelers         Moving
Bath Fitter            Unmanned Kiosk
Amazing Space         Vending Machines
Claw Kicker         Vending Machines
EcoATM            Vending Machine
MB&T ATM            Vending Machine
BAM!   
Bath & Body Works   
Brow Shapes   
Color   
Family & Friends Funland   
GNC   
Humane Society Thrift Store   
Little Green Apple Hallmark   
MasterCuts   
Mrs. Fields   
Pat Catan's   
Phoenix Theatres   
Planet Fitness   
Pretzelmaker   
Shoe Dept.   
Spencer's   
Taco Bell   
Wu Ji Acupressure & Reflexology   

I can't see what's left paying for security and utilities.   Planet Fitness, Phoenix, and Pat Catans could stay open with the interior of the mall closing, though they'd have to build a wall by the theaters.   Any of those other interior stores could probably move relatively quick to any number of open spots in various strip malls and probably do better business.   If they even wanted to stay in Monroe.   I expect the traditional mall chains on that list will close by the time Carsons closes.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 20, 2018, 02:00:14 PM
Here's the current situation.

Carson's            Closing
Carson's Home Store      Closing
f.y.e.             Closing
Kay Jewelers         Moving
Bath Fitter            Unmanned Kiosk
Amazing Space         Vending Machines
Claw Kicker         Vending Machines
EcoATM            Vending Machine
MB&T ATM            Vending Machine
BAM!   
Bath & Body Works   
Brow Shapes   
Color   
Family & Friends Funland   
GNC   
Humane Society Thrift Store   
Little Green Apple Hallmark   
MasterCuts   
Mrs. Fields   
Pat Catan's   
Phoenix Theatres   
Planet Fitness   
Pretzelmaker   
Shoe Dept.   
Spencer's   
Taco Bell   
Wu Ji Acupressure & Reflexology   

I can't see what's left paying for security and utilities.   Planet Fitness, Phoenix, and Pat Catans could stay open with the interior of the mall closing, though they'd have to build a wall by the theaters.   Any of those other interior stores could probably move relatively quick to any number of open spots in various strip malls and probably do better business.   If they even wanted to stay in Monroe.   I expect the traditional mall chains on that list will close by the time Carsons closes.


Planet Fitness and Pat Catan's are already essentially 'free standing'.  I'm sure the theater would want to try to make a go of things at least for the time being.  They've made quite an investment there in the last few years and I'd guess they probably still owe on that and would like to try to recoup at least part of it.  They can probably sell or move the fancy seats and projection but all the work on building the screens will be lost if they have to close down.  I could see putting some kind of a rolling gate across to fence off the mall beyond the theater entrance for the time being.  Where would become the question.  With just the theater is there even enough traffic for MB&T to maintain their ATM.  Mrs. Field's and the pretzel shop are probably not going to move anywhere into a free standing shop.  If so they would both have to get bigger I would think.  They're both kind of just 'mall food' stores.  Is there enough traffic from the theater to keep them going.  I would doubt it.  No way Taco Bell can stay with just theater traffic.  Maybe the theater would want to expand out into the present food court and open something of their own for food.

I'd say the 'Mall' is getting closer and closer to the demolition ball.  Malls are out of fashion anyway.  The idea hatched in the late 50 and early 60's has run it's course.  Time to move on...

I have a feeling it will sit closed off for a long, long time.

Not sure yet if it will close for sure (I lean that way right now) but I doubt they'll be in a big hurry to tear it down.  I'm sure there are plenty of lenders involved that are going to have some input on that.  If the mall owners get forced into bankruptcy then things could change fast. 

I would guess we'll see a 'sale' in the near future to a new entity that is set up just to protect the current owner's interest as best as can be. 

Only time will tell for sure!

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 20, 2018, 02:08:48 PM
Malls are out of fashion like I said before.  Look at Northtown, all that is left is the freestanding Planet Fitness and an empty but fenced in field where FCA is parking cats.

It stood vacant for a number of years before the wrecking ball got it.

Pretty much impossible to repurpose a mall into anything viable.  I'm surprised the Marketplace at 75 and LaPlasance  hasn't either burned down or got demo'd.  Big plans there that went poof.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 20, 2018, 02:11:23 PM
With the wad of beaneries Monroe has, kind of surprises me they all stay in business.  The pie slices must be pretty thin.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 20, 2018, 02:13:10 PM
Adrian Mall is going the way of Monroe as well, just at a slower pace.  I remember when it was a cornfield and it may revert back to just that.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 20, 2018, 02:29:43 PM
Malls are out of fashion like I said before.  Look at Northtown, all that is left is the freestanding Planet Fitness and an empty but fenced in field where FCA is parking cats.

It stood vacant for a number of years before the wrecking ball got it.

Pretty much impossible to repurpose a mall into anything viable.  I'm surprised the Marketplace at 75 and LaPlasance  hasn't either burned down or got demo'd.  Big plans there that went poof.

Franklin Park still seems to draw pretty good.

A few of the fancier malls closer to Deetroit still seem to have plenty of business. 

The big problem with NorthTowne was Toledo was way, way overbuilt and NT was situated at the very north edge of Toledo.  There weren't enough people in Bedford Township to support 'their half' of the mall.  Down there it was a case of the strongest surviving and that is what happened.

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 20, 2018, 09:55:23 PM
Franklin Park has a gang issue so I'm told.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 21, 2018, 08:27:50 AM
Franklin Park has a gang issue so I'm told.

Do you have a link or some links to that?

I've never seen anything that even resembles any gang activity. 

There are young people there at the mall (there are stores that cater to young people) and probably at certain times there are more than others.  Does that mean they're all gang members. 

I guess to some people that equates to 'gang activity'. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 21, 2018, 08:35:20 AM
Looking back at the highs and the lows of the Mall of Monroe (Frenchtown) and trying to put a 'cause and effect' in place...

did declining foot traffic cause the stores to close or did the ever increasing number of closed stores cause the decline in foot traffic?

I do think this mall has had some bad luck over the years in that they seemed to have a high number of chains that went out of business at a national level.  It wasn't just their bad business in Monroe that caused their demise!

Any other thoughts?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on April 21, 2018, 09:32:00 AM
Franklin Park did have a gang issue.  About a year ago and maybe longer kids under 18 have to leave the mall at least by 5:00PM.  Pretty sure they can be in the theater area but that's upstairs.
There were some issues in the parking lots between gangs shooting each other occasional but i think that was probably spill over leaving the mall when they were allowed in.
Have to give FPM credit for taking a stance but the mall was in decline with the kids roaming around..
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 21, 2018, 09:54:41 AM
Franklin Park did have a gang issue.  About a year ago and maybe longer kids under 18 have to leave the mall at least by 5:00PM.  Pretty sure they can be in the theater area but that's upstairs.
There were some issues in the parking lots between gangs shooting each other occasional but i think that was probably spill over leaving the mall when they were allowed in.
Have to give FPM credit for taking a stance but the mall was in decline with the kids roaming around..

That's what I remember...   

lots and lots of unescorted teens although not particularly organized gangs.  I've never seen any sign of that. 

I haven't heard any comments about anything like that recently.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on April 21, 2018, 05:21:02 PM
Nothing lately..I don't go there often and it's usually just to Dicks.
But i have a friend that works there and says its really good now.
She still gets escorted to her vehicle after work in the evening but feels safe again.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 22, 2018, 08:57:14 AM
Nothing lately..I don't go there often and it's usually just to Dicks.
But i have a friend that works there and says its really good now.
She still gets escorted to her vehicle after work in the evening but feels safe again.

If we're going we try to get there first thing in the morning before it gets too crowded and before the parking lots get crowded.  I wouldn't be concerned going at night other than mostly the parking issue. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 22, 2018, 12:51:52 PM
Nothing lately..I don't go there often and it's usually just to Dicks.
But i have a friend that works there and says its really good now.
She still gets escorted to her vehicle after work in the evening but feels safe again.
 

You go to Dicks and own a firearm?  Amazing.  I wouldn't set foot in the door after them taking an anti- 2A stand and going as far as destroying their remaining inventory of firearms...

Dicks is just that a dickhead place.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on April 22, 2018, 12:52:58 PM
Let me say i USE to go to Dicks..
Just last week i found some summer tees for working out at Walmart that were $5.76.  Maybe even better than the $20 UA that Dicks sold..
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 22, 2018, 12:56:35 PM
Thats better..... ;D
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: rwwjr on April 22, 2018, 02:41:18 PM
Looking back at the highs and the lows of the Mall of Monroe (Frenchtown) and trying to put a 'cause and effect' in place...

did declining foot traffic cause the stores to close or did the ever increasing number of closed stores cause the decline in foot traffic?

I do think this mall has had some bad luck over the years in that they seemed to have a high number of chains that went out of business at a national level.  It wasn't just their bad business in Monroe that caused their demise!

Any other thoughts?

A while ago when the mall was full, a friend of ours wanted to lease a space for his business.  At that time, Carfaro wanted the right to audit your books any time they wanted to, take a % of your sales, PLUS a long term lease.  Needless to say my friend said pfffft.  NFW.  Do not know if it still that way or not.  If so that could play into the fact of no new patrons
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on April 22, 2018, 03:27:14 PM
Bet that changed to a KYA attitude.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 23, 2018, 08:17:53 AM
A while ago when the mall was full, a friend of ours wanted to lease a space for his business.  At that time, Carfaro wanted the right to audit your books any time they wanted to, take a % of your sales, PLUS a long term lease.  Needless to say my friend said pfffft.  NFW.  Do not know if it still that way or not.  If so that could play into the fact of no new patrons

That was a pretty common 'mall lease' back in the good ol' days but as you explain a lot of small businesses could not see additional costs.  For some business styles it was well worth it and for others it obviously wasn't that popular.

From any mall that is sitting half empty that has to be a tough negotiating point today. 

I've been meaning to ask if anyone knows if the Humane Society has a 'special rate' lease? 

I had always heard that back when they had the small store there just at Christmas they got a discounted rate. 

I usually stop and talk to the new dogs and cats when I'm there.  At one point I asked the gal that was working if they were planning on staying there after the new Humane Society building was open.  She said she knew the new building had an area for a store inside. 

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on April 23, 2018, 12:43:55 PM
I'm wondering how many units NEVER had a tenant.   I know ithere's at least one between GNC and Carsons and I believe there's 1 or 2 in the corridor that leads to Pat Catans.   They are completely walled off and I assume nothing was ever built out inside.   There were some in the food court before it was taken over the the movie theatre expansion.   

There are also numerous units who never had another tenant after the first round moved out when the first leases expired years ago.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on April 27, 2018, 12:29:05 PM
GNC announced they are closing 200 to-be-named stores.   Bet I can name one.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 27, 2018, 12:38:14 PM
GNC announced they are closing 200 to-be-named stores.   Bet I can name one.

I have walked for an hour straight in the mall and not seen one person in GNC shopping.  I suppose if they were quick they could get in and out without me seeing them. 

Not much down that corridor now that Claire's is gone!
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Professor H on April 28, 2018, 02:23:33 AM
I'll be visiting the movie theater - at Ghosttown Mall - will be interesting to take a walk around and see what's left...
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on April 28, 2018, 08:31:57 AM
I'll be visiting the movie theater - at Ghosttown Mall - will be interesting to take a walk around and see what's left...

If we don't hear from you in a few days we'll send out a search party 8) 8) 8)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on May 10, 2018, 10:36:20 AM
Mall of Monroe responds to questions and rumors!!!

https://www.facebook.com/monroenews/posts/10156395325631692 (https://www.facebook.com/monroenews/posts/10156395325631692)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on May 10, 2018, 10:41:12 AM
We went there yesterday to a business but not to walk...

other than in and out. 

We stopped by the Humane Society store to visit the critters.

When we were leaving and stepped out into the main corridor of the mall there was just exactly one other couple that I could see in that entire corridor and they were down near the food court. 

I walked by FYE and see that they have savings up to 90% off...

now they're getting serious.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on May 11, 2018, 08:16:23 AM
They can deny they are closing all they want.   Simple economics says momentum isn't going their way.   Their leasing agents have been "working hard" since Sears left.   Also, based on that post and some of the replies by the mall itself, clearly whoever manages Mall of Monroe's Facebook page isn't a PR expert.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on May 11, 2018, 10:30:31 AM
They can deny they are closing all they want.   Simple economics says momentum isn't going their way.   Their leasing agents have been "working hard" since Sears left.   Also, based on that post and some of the replies by the mall itself, clearly whoever manages Mall of Monroe's Facebook page isn't a PR expert.

Any idea what the timeline is for Kay Jewelry to make their move?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on May 11, 2018, 12:19:49 PM
I haven't seen any sign of construction but Frenchtown approved the site plan.   The listing says available Oct 1.

http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/N-Telegraph-Rd-Mall-Road-Monroe-MI/12233562/ (http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/N-Telegraph-Rd-Mall-Road-Monroe-MI/12233562/)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on May 11, 2018, 01:02:09 PM
I haven't seen any sign of construction but Frenchtown approved the site plan.   The listing says available Oct 1.

[url]http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/N-Telegraph-Rd-Mall-Road-Monroe-MI/12233562/[/url] ([url]http://www.loopnet.com/Listing/N-Telegraph-Rd-Mall-Road-Monroe-MI/12233562/[/url])


I'm confused now.  This rendering shows the site as being on the north side of Walmart up closer to the TSC store:

(http://images4.loopnet.com/i2/azXQeAlLgYYt2eHg9KB1xeb15WVcDtF4nY4Rk0xYcQw/112/image.jpg)


But this one appears to show it replacing Applebees!

(http://images1.loopnet.com/i2/SCUIdKOoX9qDmadOIMm9yd1KkNFQox55UHqJnnqNw5Q/112/image.jpg)

The 2nd slide does show the parcels as being triangular shaped so it must be on the north side of Walmart. 

Mall road loops around and comes back out to meet the entrance to Walmart.  Maybe that is considered Mall Road.  That would make everything fit just fine I guess.

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on May 12, 2018, 01:42:49 PM
Google Maps says its Mall all the way around, so it must be so.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Maverick on May 12, 2018, 03:17:23 PM
It is definitely the property just North of Murphy's
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on May 12, 2018, 04:20:21 PM
At some point, the utilities cost will exceed the rent realized and taxes don't decrease either.  It will close at some point and I suspect it won't be all that long.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Maverick on May 12, 2018, 04:23:22 PM
I can't imagine how it's not running in the red already.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on May 14, 2018, 09:18:22 AM
I can't imagine how it's not running in the red already.

I don't know the 'big picture' of Frenchtown Square Partnership. 

Maybe it's an arm of a much larger company that needs the writeoff or maybe it's a large scale money laundering operation.

Cafaro was the original owner and operator but now all the ownership on the tax rolls is under Frenctown Square Partnership.

Quote
FRENCHTOWN SQUARE PARTNERSHIP   07 000 121 00 (Parcel Number)   2121 N MONROE   **Personal Property
FRENCHTOWN SQUARE PARTNERSHIP   07 065 093 01 (Parcel Number)   2121 N MONROE   
FRENCHTOWN SQUARE PARTNERSHIP   07 065 093 02 (Parcel Number)   MALL RD   
FRENCHTOWN SQUARE PARTNERSHIP   07 065 093 03 (Parcel Number)   MALL RD   
FRENCHTOWN SQUARE PARTNERSHIP   07 065 093 04 (Parcel Number)   N MALL RD   
FRENCHTOWN SQUARE PARTNERSHIP   07 079 023 00 (Parcel Number)   N TELEGRAPH   
FRENCHTOWN SQUARE PARTNERSHIP   07 079 023 10 (Parcel Number)   2100 N TELEGRAPH   
FRENCHTOWN SQUARE PARTNERSHIP   07 079 023 99 (Parcel Number)   2100 N TELEGRAPH   
FRENCHTOWN SQUARE PARTNERSHIP   07 065 093 00 (Parcel Number)   2121 N MONROE   
firstprev

When calculating mall occupancy the one 'tenant' that is usually overlooked is Applebee's. 

I also recall that when they were putting in the Starbuck's there was some issue with Starbuck's having to obtain a right of way across mall property to be able to obtain access to Mall Road. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on May 14, 2018, 10:17:07 AM
Probably just a legal maneuver to isolate their properties.   A lot of times you'll see a commercial property located at 123 Main Street as being owned by 123 Main Street LLC.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on May 14, 2018, 12:01:51 PM
Wonder what the monthly utilities, insurance and upkeep costs are.  Whoever owns it has to be in the red big time.  Sort of like the Adrian mall but I suspect their overhead is a bit less (they still have some occupants to offset costs).
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on May 15, 2018, 07:54:27 AM
Wonder what the monthly utilities, insurance and upkeep costs are.  Whoever owns it has to be in the red big time.  Sort of like the Adrian mall but I suspect their overhead is a bit less (they still have some occupants to offset costs).


I went to the Cafaro website.  http://www.cafarocompany.com/cafaro-properties/ (http://www.cafarocompany.com/cafaro-properties/)

It  looks like they own somewhere between 12 and 18 malls across the country. 

If they're all in a similar situation as Monroe then they are probably hurting.

If Monroe is their only 'problem child' then they should be able to handle what is (or isn't) happening here in Monroe just fine. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on June 15, 2018, 09:36:09 AM
I saw a couple of guys carrying banners for the Carson's Going Out Of Business Sale Yesterday.  They were actually clear down at the intersection of Cole and Monroe Street.  I didn't get up as far as the mall to see if they had another group there. 

Telegraph and Mall would seem like the best place to me but again didn't get that far to see if there was anyone there.

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on June 15, 2018, 09:54:37 AM
I see FCA has put the old Northtowne Mall area to use.  I can't begin to estimate how many new vehicles they have stored there.  They cover the entire property including what was the mall and parking.  Other than what was Monkey Wards which is the gym
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on June 15, 2018, 10:02:52 AM
I see FCA has put the old Northtowne Mall area to use.  I can't begin to estimate how many new vehicles they have stored there.  They cover the entire property including what was the mall and parking.  Other than what was Monkey Wards which is the gym

They have another one over by the prison at the north end of the Green Belt Parkway and at least one more out by Toledo Express Airport.  They had multi vehicle fires at the one by the airport and the one by the prison.  They were investigating but I never have heard what they finally decided.

Someone has what looks like a new vehicle storage yard up along 275 north of Telegraph. 

Ford stores a lot of vehicles near the plant in Flat Rock.

I had an interesting conversation with a Gal at the state park last fall that works for a company that ships F150s overseas.  Something they have to modify on some trucks depending on 'where' they're going and then they prep them for shipping overseas. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: halo_girl on June 16, 2018, 07:20:25 AM
I saw a couple of guys carrying banners for the Carson's Going Out Of Business Sale Yesterday.  They were actually clear down at the intersection of Cole and Monroe Street.  I didn't get up as far as the mall to see if they had another group there. 

Telegraph and Mall would seem like the best place to me but again didn't get that far to see if there was anyone there.

I can't remember what day it was but it was a few days ago when it was very sunny and hot out and there were three guys down there with signs at Telegraph and Mall intersection - two were in direct sunshine and one was on opposite corner under shade tree.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on June 16, 2018, 07:34:43 AM
I can't remember what day it was but it was a few days ago when it was very sunny and hot out and there were three guys down there with signs at Telegraph and Mall intersection - two were in direct sunshine and one was on opposite corner under shade tree.
I'll bet I know which one was the boss ;) ;) ;)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: halo_girl on June 16, 2018, 07:42:15 AM
I'll bet I know which one was the boss ;) ;) ;)

Hmmmmm you don't think maybe the "boss" was one of the ones under the direct sunshine??? Nahhhhh guess you are right, yeah boss would under the nice shade tree of course LOL
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: Professor H on June 16, 2018, 09:37:34 AM
Parking "new" cars at the Northtowne parking lot seems like a dangerous thing - based on the clientele in the neighborhood ...   

Must have a full time security staff!     
 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on June 16, 2018, 09:43:52 AM
Parking "new" cars at the Northtowne parking lot seems like a dangerous thing - based on the clientele in the neighborhood ...   

Must have a full time security staff!   

The ones I've seen all have some sort of at least a temporary fence around them and always some security people.  Usually there are crews there loading and unloading vehicles and moving them around most of the time too.  If you sit and watch there's more going on that just a bunch of new vehicles setting around.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on June 16, 2018, 10:55:10 AM
There is housing off the road behind the mall area but i've never heard or seen any problems there.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on June 16, 2018, 11:27:43 AM
Parking "new" cars at the Northtowne parking lot seems like a dangerous thing - based on the clientele in the neighborhood ...   

Must have a full time security staff!   

The new Ann Arbor Railroad auto handling facility is right across Telegraph from where they are currently storing the cars at the former NorthTowne Mall site.  Maybe AA railway has bought the mall property too.  Once they're done building they should have room to stock pile some vehicles on the new project site. 

Typically property goes to the highest and best use and if that is all they can use it for at this point at least it's not just growing weeds.

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: blue2 on June 16, 2018, 11:50:29 AM
http://crimemap.toledo.oh.gov/ (http://crimemap.toledo.oh.gov/)

this doesn't show much criminal activity around NT mall area.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on June 30, 2018, 11:29:11 AM
The mall in Midland was sold out of receivership this week. 

Lots of similarities with the mall here and that one. 

Midland probably has a stronger local economy but also no major cities surrounding it like Monroe has.

Their plans to draw new tenants are interesting.

https://www.ourmidland.com/news/article/Midland-Mall-sold-to-Kohan-Retail-Investment-Group-13037057.php#photo-15801485 (https://www.ourmidland.com/news/article/Midland-Mall-sold-to-Kohan-Retail-Investment-Group-13037057.php#photo-15801485)

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on June 30, 2018, 03:35:00 PM
That dude is trouble   https://www.heraldpalladium.com/news/local/orchards-mall-s-new-owner-rescuer-or-bad-apple/article_a98e8373-ac11-591e-9c16-55e68883b34a.html (https://www.heraldpalladium.com/news/local/orchards-mall-s-new-owner-rescuer-or-bad-apple/article_a98e8373-ac11-591e-9c16-55e68883b34a.html)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on July 01, 2018, 09:00:27 AM
That dude is trouble   https://www.heraldpalladium.com/news/local/orchards-mall-s-new-owner-rescuer-or-bad-apple/article_a98e8373-ac11-591e-9c16-55e68883b34a.html (https://www.heraldpalladium.com/news/local/orchards-mall-s-new-owner-rescuer-or-bad-apple/article_a98e8373-ac11-591e-9c16-55e68883b34a.html)

The article is almost 4 years old and the dude is still buying malls.  He's either got deep pockets or he does a great job of convincing banks or private investors to go along with him. 

Only time will tell with this project in Midland.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on July 01, 2018, 09:09:42 AM
True, but this is how he "affords" them:

https://www.heraldpalladium.com/news/local/orchards-mall-flirts-with-foreclosure/article_300ac618-d678-5c9d-b1e4-79ae989a72a3.html (https://www.heraldpalladium.com/news/local/orchards-mall-flirts-with-foreclosure/article_300ac618-d678-5c9d-b1e4-79ae989a72a3.html)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on July 01, 2018, 09:23:25 AM
True, but this is how he "affords" them:

https://www.heraldpalladium.com/news/local/orchards-mall-flirts-with-foreclosure/article_300ac618-d678-5c9d-b1e4-79ae989a72a3.html (https://www.heraldpalladium.com/news/local/orchards-mall-flirts-with-foreclosure/article_300ac618-d678-5c9d-b1e4-79ae989a72a3.html)

A lot of business people use a similar approach to paying government related bills.  For whatever reason those bills don't go on your credit report. 

I'm not saying that it's 'right' but rather that it happens. 

Perfect scenario here...   it appears that his business is 'struggling' because they're late on paying taxes on one property and yet over in central Michigan they're plopping down millions to acquire another property. 

If he loses the mall in Midland to taxes then someone is going to get an even better 'deal' down the road. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on July 03, 2018, 07:39:16 AM
I suppose he's probably flipped some of them for redevelopment and some probably eek out some profit.  Midland seems like its probably a little like Monroe--lot bigger cities (Saginaw/Bay City) a short drive away.   Except Midland I would guess is more affluent.

But honestly, I wouldn't be surprised that it eventually comes out that the whole thing is a front for something.

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on July 03, 2018, 12:49:57 PM
Had to go to Lowes on Telegraph for a piece of PVC pip[e the other day and I'm glad I don't get that way often.  What a fuster cluck with traffic.  Went by the mall too.  Pretty dead
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on July 04, 2018, 09:15:24 AM
Yep, Telegraph from the 7th Street to Lowes is easily 15 minutes of frustration many days.   
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on July 04, 2018, 09:22:10 AM
I suppose he's probably flipped some of them for redevelopment and some probably eek out some profit.  Midland seems like its probably a little like Monroe--lot bigger cities (Saginaw/Bay City) a short drive away.   Except Midland I would guess is more affluent.

But honestly, I wouldn't be surprised that it eventually comes out that the whole thing is a front for something.

Entirely possible!
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on July 04, 2018, 09:33:21 AM
Had to go to Lowes on Telegraph for a piece of PVC pip[e the other day and I'm glad I don't get that way often.  What a fuster cluck with traffic.  Went by the mall too.  Pretty dead

Leave M-50 at Lewis or Raisinville and head north.  Work your way up to Stewart and head east.  You can take a 'shortcut' through the Arbor Creek subdivision and emerge at the back of Lowe's in the stock area.  Not a single traffic light since you left M-50!!!  Don't speed going through the subdivision and no one will be any the wiser.  Many of the roads in that stretch have been resurfaced in the last few years so the trip is actually fairly smooth too. 

Not near the traffic and lots and lots of farm fields.  You might even see a pheasant (we saw one yesterday over in Hillsdale County).

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on July 04, 2018, 10:00:51 PM
Didn't know there was a back way but then I don't get up that way often.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on July 04, 2018, 11:04:09 PM
Didn't know there was a back way but then I don't get up that way often.

Google maps works great even for places you've never been before!!!
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on July 05, 2018, 08:13:10 AM
Second time I've been up that way on a couple years.  I don't care much for driving around Monroe.  Like Adrian proper, congested.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on July 05, 2018, 09:00:35 AM
Second time I've been up that way on a couple years.  I don't care much for driving around Monroe.  Like Adrian proper, congested.

I guess we won't see you driving a cab in New York or Los Angeles!
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on July 10, 2018, 01:49:47 PM
Internet rumor, Hallmark is closing next.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: The Fuzz on July 10, 2018, 04:00:38 PM
They weren't on the list on a report out today?

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/retail/2018/07/10/shopping-struggles-11-retailers-may-not-survive-2018/36720811/ (https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/retail/2018/07/10/shopping-struggles-11-retailers-may-not-survive-2018/36720811/)

Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on July 10, 2018, 05:19:13 PM
The Monroe location, not all of Hallmark.   Though in general the greeting card business isn’t what it used to be. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on August 24, 2018, 01:25:29 PM
Bon Ton announced today that all their stores by next Wednesday, if not sooner.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: nails on August 24, 2018, 01:39:40 PM
The Monroe location, not all of Hallmark.   Though in general the greeting card business isn’t what it used to be.

With Hallmark cards costing $5-6 each, they should be making more money than a crack dealer.  No wonder people aren’t buying as many.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on August 24, 2018, 03:15:45 PM
Bon Ton announced today that all their stores by next Wednesday, if not sooner.

We saw the picket crew out in front of the former K-Mart store yesterday and they had one sign that said they were closing in 4 more days.  Also signs saying all fixtures for sale at up to 30% off prior prices. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on August 24, 2018, 03:18:48 PM
With Hallmark cards costing $5-6 each, they should be making more money than a crack dealer.  No wonder people aren’t buying as many.

I have various colors of card stock and just print a card out of the computer if I need one.

Today people are all connected on Facebook and Twitter or facetime or whatever.  Unless you're sending something to a non techie why would you even think about going to Hallmark.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: jbs49238 on August 25, 2018, 02:38:05 AM
Wait!!!!! Monroe has a mall?
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on August 25, 2018, 10:07:08 AM
Had.   Monroe HAD a mall.   Now we have a movie theater, a Pat Catans and a couple random stores.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on August 25, 2018, 11:08:26 AM
Had.   Monroe HAD a mall.   Now we have a movie theater, a Pat Catans and a couple random stores.

You missed the Humane Society's store.

Do you have any idea if the Humane Society pays rent for their space?  It's becoming one of my favorite places to shop at the mall.  I know they're working on their new building and I think I read that both the shelter on Telegraph and the retail store would both be moving to their new site on N. Monroe Street. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on September 08, 2018, 10:05:30 AM
BonTon says it's coming back but it doesn't look like they're planning any stores in Michigan.  Going mostly for an 'on line' presence.  Wonder how that will work out for them?

http://www.wfmz.com/business/department-store-bon-ton-says-it-s-coming-back/791342773 (http://www.wfmz.com/business/department-store-bon-ton-says-it-s-coming-back/791342773)
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: SidecarFlip on September 10, 2018, 03:55:58 PM
When I went by the other day, was a big sign out front...'Outlots for sale'  They should be selling or leasing in lots not out lots I'd think.  Malls have went out of style.  Adrian is the same, just not quite as bad.
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: ytrewq on September 10, 2018, 09:03:47 PM
The company that bought the Bon Ton brands is the same Chinese backed company that is bringing back the Direct Buy membership home products scam. 
Title: Re: Mall of Monroe... will it survive?
Post by: BigRedDog on September 11, 2018, 06:17:14 AM
The company that bought the Bon Ton brands is the same Chinese backed company that is bringing back the Direct Buy membership home products scam. 

We got invited to one of their after hours open houses one time.  Up front they make it sound like a deal that's too good to be true.  Once I started asking some hard questions I pretty much got 'un invited' real fast.  Funny thing is when I left several others got up and followed.