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Categories => News => Topic started by: rnrhar on August 27, 2007, 07:09:16 AM

Title: Housing market woes....
Post by: rnrhar on August 27, 2007, 07:09:16 AM
We just got an offer on our house, The first offer in over a year on the market.  All in all, they offered 40,000 less than asking, and our home is listed under 125,000.  How disappointing.  Of course we have to counter-offer.  Anybody have housing market woes like myself??

I think I just saved this to the wrong category.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: chuntley on August 27, 2007, 08:04:17 AM
I can't believe the realitor brought you a offer 40,000 less than your asking. We had my wifes house on the market for about 2 years. We went through 2 realitors and not one offer. We finally rented it but the renter is moving to annarbor so I think we will let it sit empty. Good renters are hard to find.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: sullivan on August 27, 2007, 09:45:10 AM
I can't believe the realitor brought you a offer 40,000 less than your asking. We had my wifes house on the market for about 2 years. We went through 2 realitors and not one offer. We finally rented it but the renter is moving to annarbor so I think we will let it sit empty. Good renters are hard to find.

Realtors are bound by their duties as a Realtor to deliver ALL offers to a seller regardless of how ridiculous.

If a Realtor did not deliver an offer to the seller , they would be legally liable for failure to perform their duties and could and probably would in our law suit minded society be sued and lose a lawsuit brought by either the seller or the buyer.

If you decide to leave your property empty as you suggest : It voids the homeowners ( hazard ) insurance from payment if there is a subsequent claim.
A property left vacant is one of the biggest hazards that insurance companies are confronted with and they will never pay a claim on a vacant property if they are  aware that it has been vacant for a period of usually 30 days or more.
Vandalism to a vacant building is a very large risk in it being vacant, as I'm sure you have observed how buildings that have been left vacant attract that type of activity.

If you screen your renters and spell out your expectations to them in a written lease , your chances of finding a good renter increase.
It would be better for you to rent your property for under the fair market rental value then to leave it vacant or pay the exorbitantly  high premium you would pay for a policy that covers a vacant situation.

I am a licensed Associate Broker Realtor and a multi line Independent insurance agent and although I never claim to have all the answers , I have been doing these professions for about 37 years and enjoy assisting people if they feel I can.

Best of Luck and the key to any working relationship is honest and factual communication.
 J. Pat Mc Elligott   
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: sschmitt on August 27, 2007, 10:48:35 AM
Try selling your townhouse for what (or near what) you paid for it when brand new townhouses are being built all around you and selling for $30,000 less!!!! The same floor plan, same everything -- only $30,000 less. We would like to buy a bigger house with a yard for our kids, but when we met with a realtor the other night she basically was ready to pack up her papers and leave when we refused to sell it for the same price as the new townhomes. We just can't afford to do that!! Why sell our place for next to nothing and then still be left with a partial mortgage because we couldn't cover all our costs?? Then we would have nowhere to live and a debt left over!

We have to refinance our ARM mortgage in January....... (When we got it three years ago who knew the housing market would go bust?!). It makes me wonder if we will even be able to afford our payments since we won't be able to sell our house. It's a very scary time!
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: sue lee on August 27, 2007, 11:09:00 AM
We finally decided to rent my husbands house in Calhoun County, no offers, nothing in a year.  We just had the lease signed this week end. We are nervous about being landlords, but feel it is better than letting the house sit empty.
There is no housing market. If you can hold on, try to. Who knows what will happen in this economy . I don't think we have hit bottom yet.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: chuntley on August 27, 2007, 12:18:39 PM
Thank you for your advice J Pat but I have already had the house insured as a empty and it is cheaper than having to do major repairs after a renter. Renters will not, in most cases care about your home as you do. They know once they tear up your house they just have to move to the next house. As far as a lease,, it is only as good as the paper it is written on,, a 30 day notice and 1 month rent can get you out of any lease in the state of Michigan, and when it comes to damages ,, what are you going to do? Sue them? You might win, but winning doesn't a judgement get your money . Then there is the yearly inspection fees from the city of Monroe.
I had a realtor get mad at my wife because we had a for sale by owner sign in the yard. She preceded to tell my wife that she was taking food from her family,,, I will not tell you the rest of the story.
If it cost me more to keep the house in the great condition it is in ,,, so be it. I did it for 2 years prior to this renter.

Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: rnrhar on August 27, 2007, 12:30:54 PM
We really, really need to move.  I did school of choice and I have to cart the kids to school 35 minutes one way.  I have been doing it for half days for two years.  This year my oldest goes to full day school and the middle one goes to half day, so I have to be at that school 3 times a day.  I totally screwed myself over on that one.  Gas cost alone saved could pay for another house payment.  We were asked by our realtor if we wanted to rent the house out, but I am just too afraid of the mess that might be left behind.  We don't make enough to afford two house payments at any time.

I am almost desperate enough to call it even and leave with nothing.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: TheShepherd on August 27, 2007, 12:41:25 PM
chuntley is absolutely right. Good renters are hard to find.
As strange as it seems, we found a better tenant at lower rent than we ever had with a slightly higher rent. I would be pretty desperate to actually rent a house out. Our rental is above a garage.
One tip on renting: renting to younger people or students seems to fare better than renting to what I like to call  "career renters" . They seem to be the ones to be less concerned about the property.
Remember though, these are just my personal experiences and I am not in any way saying every renter is the same.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: Stephanie on August 27, 2007, 12:54:20 PM
Shepard,
Sorry that's been your experience, but I had to chime in as a "career renter". My guy and I are definitely not students, are almost-30's professionals and have never owned our own home. Renting offers us flexibility that owning can't. For instance right now we live in a lakefront home there's no way we could afford. If we decide to move or make a decision to try out a different area of town, all we really have to worry about is putting in our notice.
Our landlords - though I hate that term - have allowed us to treat the home like it's ours, like being able to paint the walls, change things, put in a garden, etc. which really contributes to us treating it like our own rather than a place of temporary residence.
I think it doesn't really matter if you're renters or owners - some people take care of properties and some don't. After browsing a ton of homes for sale in the County area I can confidently say that some of the owners are probably worse because they've had 20 years plus or minus to leave their marks.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: TheShepherd on August 27, 2007, 01:13:17 PM
Stephanie, that is exactly why I said that I don't think everyone is the same. I attempted to phrase in a way not to offend. But the fact is, they're out there.
I have an older brother and sister, both married with kids and grandkids who only rent. It works well for them.
But as a landlord you just need to be careful and sometimes keep your fingers crossed.
Once again, I was not out to offend you or anyone else. But if someone is looking to rent their house out, I just wanted to let them know there can be many headaches. Not always. But it is best to be prepared.
Have a nice day.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: Stephanie on August 27, 2007, 01:15:34 PM
No offense taken. Just thought I would voice the other p.o.v.
That said, I wouldn't ever want to be a landlord. I can imagine it's a total headache.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: chuntley on August 27, 2007, 03:01:18 PM
Shepard,
Sorry that's been your experience, but I had to chime in as a "career renter". My guy and I are definitely not students, are almost-30's professionals and have never owned our own home. Renting offers us flexibility that owning can't. For instance right now we live in a lakefront home there's no way we could afford. If we decide to move or make a decision to try out a different area of town, all we really have to worry about is putting in our notice.
Our landlords - though I hate that term - have allowed us to treat the home like it's ours, like being able to paint the walls, change things, put in a garden, etc. which really contributes to us treating it like our own rather than a place of temporary residence.
I think it doesn't really matter if you're renters or owners - some people take care of properties and some don't. After browsing a ton of homes for sale in the County area I can confidently say that some of the owners are probably worse because they've had 20 years plus or minus to leave their marks.
All the good renters are taken ,,,,,, and the home owners are not giving the the good renters up,,
I wish I could find a renter like you ,,, I would be happy as a Lark
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: sue lee on August 27, 2007, 03:42:15 PM
We are renting now till we decide if and when to buy. I kind of like the freedom of renting right now. We want lakefront, or close to it, and have looked a bit. We have not found exactly what we want.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: BigRedDog on August 27, 2007, 04:10:29 PM
Try selling your townhouse for what (or near what) you paid for it when brand new townhouses are being built all around you and selling for $30,000 less!!!! The same floor plan, same everything -- only $30,000 less. We would like to buy a bigger house with a yard for our kids, but when we met with a realtor the other night she basically was ready to pack up her papers and leave when we refused to sell it for the same price as the new townhomes. We just can't afford to do that!! Why sell our place for next to nothing and then still be left with a partial mortgage because we couldn't cover all our costs?? Then we would have nowhere to live and a debt left over!

We have to refinance our ARM mortgage in January....... (When we got it three years ago who knew the housing market would go bust?!). It makes me wonder if we will even be able to afford our payments since we won't be able to sell our house. It's a very scary time!

OK sschmitt....   The whole real estate market is down, not just your townhouse.  Sell now, take your loss, buy something nicer (which may even be down 40-50,000)....   when the market goes back positive, you are ahead, perhaps even more than when you bought your townhouse.

a possilbe glitch on re-financing your ARM in January...   depending upon how much down payment you put down when you bought your townhouse....  in most cases (I do not know your particulars) a new mortgage will require a new appraisal.  It sounds pretty obvious that it is going to be difficult to impossible to get an appraisal anywhere near what you paid.  Unless you put that much down, you may not be able to get a new mortgage in January. 

If that is the scenario then you might want to discuss the situation with your current lender.  SOMETIMES, they are willing to work with you on a "short sale"....   you may or may not be forgiven the balance you may owe.  To add insult to injury, the IRS looks at that as income and charges you income tax on that amount.  I believe there is a change in the works to remove that burden.

You need to talk to your old mortgage company and a new mortgage company, get all the facts, and then decide when to sell the townhouse.  But, the longer you wait the lower your sale price, and hopefully the lower any new purchase price will go.

As much as you don't like the thought of the short sale, it may be the best overall scenario for the forseeable future.  Do some more investigation now, DO NOT WAIT UNTIL JANUARY!!!
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: forever39 on August 28, 2007, 01:47:27 PM

We have owned rental property in the city for 11 years - we have apartments that are on the same property as our home.  We have seen many changes in renters - seems that many people bought homes when the interest and down payment were so low, so it really did have an impact on landlords.  We now may have 5 or 6 applicants for an apartment whereas 5 years ago we would have 20 or more.  We have had good and bad tenants - more recently, more bad than good.  However, I know there are many people who rent who take care of the property very well - I have several renters in my own family.  I also believe there is a big difference in renting apartments and renting a house.

We screen as carefully as possible but we have come to realize that when you rent to someone, you are also renting to everyone they know.  Guests and/or family members of tenants can be problems just as much as the tenant(s) themselves - sometimes more.

We are also amused when many people assume we make tons of money from our apartments - they do not realize how many times we have to put so much money into an apartment that a tenant has damaged, etc. that it takes several months of the new tenant's rent to break even.  And as far as collecting damages and/or unpaid rent that exceeds the security deposit, good luck!  It is very difficult and sometimes just not worth the effort.

Our only objection to the city inspection program is the expense - jumped from $25 per unit to $75 per unit.  We keep our apartments up very well & do not ask people to live in any condition that we could not live in, such as broken plumbing, unclean, unsanitary or unsafe conditions, etc.  There are many bad landlords out there, too.

We plan to sell our property within the next year or so depending on the housing market.  The headaches are just not worth it.  We may even become renters!

Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: Frenchfry on August 28, 2007, 02:00:57 PM
Judging by the condition of the rental properties in Frenchtown, I doubt they have an inspection program at all.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: sue lee on August 28, 2007, 03:17:30 PM
All of yhese bad renter stories are making me nervous. Our renter seems to be okay, but what if we are wrong? Like I said this is our first time renting (as landlords)
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: TheShepherd on August 28, 2007, 05:11:19 PM
sue lee, in my experience if they're going to be bad renters most of them show it within the first few months. Good luck and know everyone else has the same concerns.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: lordfly on August 29, 2007, 01:26:26 AM
We lucked out with the most laid back landlord ever. We're not very loud people (maybe some late night jazz or the occasional Beethoven's 9th during crunch time, but...), but we're trying not to step on his toes. Nicest guy in the world, though.

There are many renters that trash places, however. We just want to be quiet and be left alone.
Title: Re: Housing market woes....
Post by: livewire on August 30, 2007, 08:51:04 AM
For what it's worth, I sold off all of my rental properties two years ago, while there was still a little value left in them.  I could see the bubble was about to burst, especially when all my good tenants bought their own homes.  I see now that most of those properties are vacant now. 

When I had tenants, we were lucky to get ones that PAID.  Quite honestly, if they caused some damage to the property, it was almost expected.  I had one tenant that treated the property better than I treat my own home, but she never paid her rent!  She was a registered nurse, made REAL good money, was a real nice person, and all of her references checked out perfectly, but she just didn't pay her rent.  She always had an excuse.  It takes two to three months to evict these deadbeats, which is more time where you have no income.  Ugh!  You sure can't judge a book by it's cover, or by their references.

I feel sorry for anyone that has to sell their home right now.  You will most likely sell for a substantial loss.  You must make a decision - sell now at a small loss, or sell later at a larger loss, or try to hold on through the market bottom, which could be years away.  We have not hit bottom in this housing market.  That's OK though.  I'm sure our property taxes will come down to reflect the lower values.  Yeah, right.