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[Chips]

THE JOB - URINE TEST

Like a lot of folks in this State, I have a job. I work, they pay me. I pay my taxes and the government distributes my taxes as it sees fit. In order to get that paycheck, I am required to pass a random urine test with which I have no problem. What I do have a problem with is the distribution of my taxes to people who don't have to pass a urine test.  Shouldn't one have to pass a urine test to get a welfare check because I have to pass one to earn it for them? Please understand, I have no problem with helping people get back on their feet. I do, on the other hand, have a problem with helping someone sitting on their *** doing drugs, while I work. . . . Can you imagine how much money the state would save if people had to pass a urine test to get a public assistance check?

                                           'Urine or You're Out'

[zard0z]

I understand what you're talking about here and to a point I do agree, but I also think that drug tests are an invasion of privacy, an employer shouldn't have the right to dictate what a person does in the privacy in his own home.  Whether that be drinking, drugs, or sex with animals(that's some what of a joke)...But I also do understand that it is perfectly acceptable of an employer to have these policies and if an individual wishes to work there, they must up hold that policy. But, I do not think random drug tests by the government is a solution to poverty.

I see what you're getting at, but I don't like the implications of where it could lead...Too much control is never a good thing. 

[Funroe goodtime committee]

I agree with Zar completely. It's a slippery slope.

The entire issue of Marijuana Legality is rife with hypocrisy.

Should employers have requisite random breathalyzers, too? Why cover one vice?

If that kind of attitude of suspension of privacy ever came in vogue, and pervaded legislature, it would

be bad for everybody. Who's keeping files on the file keepers?

[Boylanjl]

I agree with Chips on this one, if you want Gov't assistance, take a drug test.  People can say it is their private life and thier business what they do in their home.  But look it at this way, maybe if they weren't doing the drugs, they could get a job and make something for themselves. I also believe that if your on Welfare and not in a some type job training program, you should be out along the highways picking up trash.   I do not believe in free rides on my tax dollars.  I have to earn my money, so why should someone sit at home and just collect a check?    I understand people loose jobs and there is a need for unemployment and welfare to get back on your feet and find a job.  BUt there are people out there who have spent too many years on welfare sitting at home doing nothing.   I remember back in high school working at Wendy's people would come in and ask the managers to sin off they applied for a job with out filling out an application.  I remember one guy was handed a application and said if he filled it out, then the manager would sign it.  The guy went off on the manager because he thought working for a fast food joint was a joke.  A customer came up to the manager after that and thanked him for not signing the paper.

Sorry for going off on the tangent, but I believe the welfare system needs a major overhaul.

[ell]

I agree with Zar completely. It's a slippery slope.

The entire issue of Marijuana Legality is rife with hypocrisy.

Should employers have requisite random breathalyzers, too? Why cover one vice?

If that kind of attitude of suspension of privacy ever came in vogue, and pervaded legislature, it would

be bad for everybody. Who's keeping files on the file keepers?

Most places that do drug screening also do alcohol screening.  They don't want their employees under the influence of anything, alcohol or drugs.  I personally don't mind it since in my business,
too many people are in a position to do me a lot of harm if they are under the influence.  It's bad enough when some of them are stone cold sober.

[katy scarlett]

I agree with Chips on this one, if you want Gov't assistance, take a drug test.  People can say it is their private life and thier business what they do in their home.  But look it at this way, maybe if they weren't doing the drugs, they could get a job and make something for themselves. I also believe that if your on Welfare and not in a some type job training program, you should be out along the highways picking up trash.   I do not believe in free rides on my tax dollars.  I have to earn my money, so why should someone sit at home and just collect a check?    I understand people loose jobs and there is a need for unemployment and welfare to get back on your feet and find a job.  BUt there are people out there who have spent too many years on welfare sitting at home doing nothing.   I remember back in high school working at Wendy's people would come in and ask the managers to sin off they applied for a job with out filling out an application.  I remember one guy was handed a application and said if he filled it out, then the manager would sign it.  The guy went off on the manager because he thought working for a fast food joint was a joke.  A customer came up to the manager after that and thanked him for not signing the paper.

 I believe the welfare system needs a major overhaul.

Exactly what I was thinking! As for the Wendy's incident, I've seen similar. I saw someone actually tell the guy handing them the app that "I am too good to work at Taco Bell". I was like are you f-ing serious? If you're getting govt assistance, your not "too good" to work anywhere (jmo). Thats a big problem I have with welfare. The people who are lazy have no problem getting help, but people who are struggling (and dont plan on abusing the system) have to fight tooth and nail to get a dime of help.

[Boylanjl]

I personally don't mind it since in my business,
too many people are in a position to do me a lot of harm if they are under the influence.  It's bad enough when some of them are stone cold sober.[/quote]


I know what you mean there ell.

[utility slug]

I agree with Chips on this one, if you want Gov't assistance, take a drug test.  People can say it is their private life and thier business what they do in their home.  But look it at this way, maybe if they weren't doing the drugs, they could get a job and make something for themselves. I also believe that if your on Welfare and not in a some type job training program, you should be out along the highways picking up trash.   I do not believe in free rides on my tax dollars.  I have to earn my money, so why should someone sit at home and just collect a check?    I understand people loose jobs and there is a need for unemployment and welfare to get back on your feet and find a job.  BUt there are people out there who have spent too many years on welfare sitting at home doing nothing.   I remember back in high school working at Wendy's people would come in and ask the managers to sin off they applied for a job with out filling out an application.  I remember one guy was handed a application and said if he filled it out, then the manager would sign it.  The guy went off on the manager because he thought working for a fast food joint was a joke.  A customer came up to the manager after that and thanked him for not signing the paper.

Sorry for going off on the tangent, but I believe the welfare system needs a major overhaul.

Well said, B...very well said.

[violet829]

I agree with Chips on this one, if you want Gov't assistance, take a drug test.  People can say it is their private life and thier business what they do in their home.  But look it at this way, maybe if they weren't doing the drugs, they could get a job and make something for themselves.

If they want to make that argument, then they should be told that they can then privately choose to support themselves and not take public money.   

You want someone else to support you?  Then you have to understand that there may be strings attached!

[cc]

Where I work we have to do hair follicle drug tests.  It amazes me how many people will sit and fill out the application (despite the fact that they are told one sheet they sign is granting permission to run the hair follicle test), and they will go through the interview.  (the whole process takes about an hour)
I send them off with paper in hand to have the drug test done and they never go.

To top that......some go take the test and it comes back positive.  We will hear the same excuse....I was at a party and people around me were doing drugs - NOPE SORRY...not buying it.

Our employees get tested once a year, or if they are involved in an accident on the job.  I'd rather fire ten people that fail a drug test than to call one persons family and say I am sorry there was an accident.

People on state assistance should be tested too.  You fail -no money.   I also think there should be programs for able bodied people to attend if they are on assistance.  Programs to help get GEDs', charity based programs, educational classes.....anything except stay at home and collect.   (again able bodied people....I understand some get assistance because they are not able to physically work)

[Boylanjl]

Where I work we have to do hair follicle drug tests.  It amazes me how many people will sit and fill out the application (despite the fact that they are told one sheet they sign is granting permission to run the hair follicle test), and they will go through the interview.  (the whole process takes about an hour)
I send them off with paper in hand to have the drug test done and they never go.

To top that......some go take the test and it comes back positive.  We will hear the same excuse....I was at a party and people around me were doing drugs - NOPE SORRY...not buying it.

Our employees get tested once a year, or if they are involved in an accident on the job.  I'd rather fire ten people that fail a drug test than to call one persons family and say I am sorry there was an accident.

People on state assistance should be tested too.  You fail -no money.   I also think there should be programs for able bodied people to attend if they are on assistance.  Programs to help get GEDs', charity based programs, educational classes.....anything except stay at home and collect.   (again able bodied people....I understand some get assistance because they are not able to physically work)

I think everyone here would agree with that statement cc.

[Frenchfry]

All drug tests should be illegal unless there is cause.

I don’t do drugs but it’s an invasion of privacy.

To single out marijuana users is absurd…..you may as well test for tobacco smokers as well because of the enormous drain on the health care system and maybe even deny those that drink alcohol.


Let’s not go back to what Henry Ford used to do:

To determine who was worthy, Ford expanded the company’s Sociological Department, set up in 1913. One-hundred fifty investigators visited employees’ homes and questioned them about everything from their marital status to their savings, health, hobbies, and child care. Excessive drinking, gambling, buying on credit, a dirty home, and an unwholesome diet were all grounds for probation; if a worker hadn’t cleaned up his act in six months, not only did he not earn his $5 a day, he was fired.

The man who had engineered the assembly line was now trying to engineer his employees’ private lives. “We want to make men in this factory as well as automobiles.” he said. The Sociological Department, which resembled contemporaneous Progressive experiments like the Urban League, was at bottom a reflection of the Victorian strictures under which Ford had been raised. Critics decried the company’s intrusion into its workers’ home lives. “The payment of good wages does not give an employer the authority to seek to regulate the internal family affairs of any man,” ran an editorial in the St. Albans, Vermont, Messenger. Finally, sick of the criticism, Ford abolished the department in 1920.
http://www.americanheritage.com/events/articles/web/20060105-henry-ford-five-dollar-day-model-t-ford-motor-company-assembly-line-james-couzens-highland-park-detroit-automobiles.shtml

[ell]

All drug tests should be illegal unless there is cause.

I don’t do drugs but it’s an invasion of privacy.

To single out marijuana users is absurd…..you may as well test for tobacco smokers as well because of the enormous drain on the health care system and maybe even deny those that drink alcohol.


Let’s not go back to what Henry Ford used to do:

Fry, I will restate my position as I posted earlier.  I don't mind the drug and alcohol screenings.  Personally, I would rather have someone caught under the influence in a random rather than part of an investigation into my injury/death on the job.  Trying to do a drug/alcohol screen on a pilot who had just plowed a 737 into the ground isn't really all that affective, if even possible.  Doing a test on a truck driver who hasn't slept in days and is behind the wheel due to a handful of pick-me-ups after he had driven over a minivan full of kids only helps in assessing blame.  For cause is often too late.

Do I care if someone likes to relax with a big fatty after work?  Absolutely not.  IMO, no worse than stopping for a tall cold one.  As long as he/she is stone cold sober when they are working with or around me.

And if someone doesn't want to do a screening as part of receiving assistance,  maybe they don't want the agency to know that they have enough money to go out and buy some dope, but not enough money to put food on the table or clothes on their kids backs.

(hopefully the spelling is good as I can't get the spell checker to work)

[Chips]

Fry, I will restate my position as I posted earlier.  I don't mind the drug and alcohol screenings.  Personally, I would rather have someone caught under the influence in a random rather than part of an investigation into my injury/death on the job.  Trying to do a drug/alcohol screen on a pilot who had just plowed a 737 into the ground isn't really all that affective, if even possible.  Doing a test on a truck driver who hasn't slept in days and is behind the wheel due to a handful of pick-me-ups after he had driven over a minivan full of kids only helps in assessing blame.  For cause is often too late.

Do I care if someone likes to relax with a big fatty after work?  Absolutely not.  IMO, no worse than stopping for a tall cold one.  As long as he/she is stone cold sober when they are working with or around me.

And if someone doesn't want to do a screening as part of receiving assistance,  maybe they don't want the agency to know that they have enough money to go out and buy some dope, but not enough money to put food on the table or clothes on their kids backs.

(hopefully the spelling is good as I can't get the spell checker to work)

I agree 100%

[the nosh]

well...the person that smoked that fat one on the weekend at home...will still test positive come monday morning at work. is that right?? is that an invasion of privacy? i would surely think so!!!!