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erfire

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #15 on: April 07, 2009, 04:53:16 PM »

I know for a fact that we, Luna Pier, had to call the City FD during one of our lovely snow storms for transport because MCA, Lifestar and Promedica all were without units available. It will be a sad and busy day when the City of Monroe loses their transport. I, for one, think they do a great job. All of our services are good but the City FD provides quick response for the immediate downtown area. MCA gets so overwhelmed some days and the border cars in Ohio (and HVA to the north) are not always available because they also run Lucas/Wayne/Washtenaw County calls. And yes, units are out of service for an extended length of time taking transports to other facilities (Downriver, Dearborn, Ann Arbor, Toledo, Tecumseh, etc.) cutting the available units responding to Monroe County calls.
Transfers out of the hospital, going to other facilities for services and patient request, are probably going to see increased wait times also.  It's a domino effect. The City of Monroe is looking to cut costs but in turn it will affect a lot of patient care down the line, not just the 911 calls.
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BigRedDog

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #16 on: April 07, 2009, 05:14:01 PM »

Maybe Luna Pier should raise their taxes to support their own citizens. Why should the city of Monroe subsidize another community. The only fair solution to all of the taxpayers county wide would be to have a county run ambulance company. It is amusing though watching the comments from outside communities telling the city of Monroe what to do with their tax dollars.


The response by the city of Monroe FD to transport was a one time event that occurs as part of
Where is station number 2?  That is the one they are closing?  I am not from  Monroe so I don't know where it is.


I'm not positive of the stations numbers...

The "main" station is at the corner of Macomb and First St...

There is a station that is referred to as the East station which is next door to the old Detroit Stoker plant.

Then there is a West station that is at the west end of Veterans Park out on N. Custer...     see link below...  the station is hidden under the trees right where the crosshair shows up ;) ;) ;)

http://mapper.acme.com/?ll=41.92484,-83.42076&z=18&t=S
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A Reasonable Person

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #17 on: April 07, 2009, 06:32:39 PM »

Maybe Luna Pier should raise their taxes to support their own citizens. Why should the city of Monroe subsidize another community. The only fair solution to all of the taxpayers county wide would be to have a county run ambulance company. It is amusing though watching the comments from outside communities telling the city of Monroe what to do with their tax dollars.

State Laws require that an ambulance service (whether public, private, or non profit) respond to a medical emergency outside of their "area" at the request of the normal ambulance service.  Hence the reason why MCA responds to medicals in the city when they are tied up and vice versa...the city responds to areas outside of the city when MCA is tied up. 
If requested to respond to Luna Pier the City FD can not say no if they have an ambulance available.
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Professor H

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #18 on: April 07, 2009, 09:55:22 PM »

State Laws require that an ambulance service (whether public, private, or non profit) respond to a medical emergency outside of their "area" at the request of the normal ambulance service.  Hence the reason why MCA responds to medicals in the city when they are tied up and vice versa...the city responds to areas outside of the city when MCA is tied up.   
If requested to respond to Luna Pier the City FD can not say no if they have an ambulance available.

Its not a state law unless the governor orders it...   in fact the government is not even responsible for providing Fire Services (or EMS)...   

What does occur is that mutual aid is requested and provided by the other service if they have another unit available - prearranged agreements to cover each jurisdiction.   If the City decides to cut its services - then the mutual aid will come from another county -
count the seconds while you wait and see if you can hold your breath that long...........    good luck.
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jbs49238

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #19 on: April 07, 2009, 10:35:26 PM »

I will admit a slight bias here, but heck I don't care.

Before I get into this I want to be sure that the City still plans to respond to all medical emergencies in the City, but eliminate transport?  If this is the case......what a stupid idea!

You will still have to run every call, pay for the vehicles when they need replaced (lets face it there is not much price difference between an ambulance and a "rescue" vehicle, pay for all the medical supplies you use, have personal with the same level of licensure...... but give up the revenues from transporting?  So you are going to keep 95% of the costs associated with running a medical call but eliminate your revenue stream?  Sounds like the folks making and voting on this need a refresher in economics.  To minimize you costs of a run 5% you are going to give up 100% of your revenue.

This is exactly what happened in Adrian (the home of your City planner) and the city of Adrian still responds to every call, but gets no revenue for transport, that money goes to LCA (aka MCA, HVA, JCA, ACA) WHEN they are available.  When LCA picked up the contracts for Raisin Twp, Ridgeway Twp, and Macon Twp, they were supposed to add another car to the area to handle the volume, guess what they did not do per se.  What they did is pull a car out of the City and "put it on point" halfway between the City of Adrian and M-50 to cover.  LCA is routinely out of position or unavailable meaning Madison Twp. (which provides ALS service for about half of Lenawee County) routinely gets pulled into the City.  LCA used to maintain the contract for the Gus Harrison Correctional facility (inside the borders of Madison Twp.) but gave it up causing an huge increase in volume for Madison Twp.  So now we get into situations where Madison gets stretched and cannot provide ALS to their normal areas. 

I know you guys may not be familiar with the geography and I am not by any means trying to bash MCA, LCA, etc. but the reality is that this is going to happen to Monroe County if the City loses its transport.  So yes in this instance it is OK for the Township residents to have some input into this matter.

The best situation is that the Townships go back to providing BLS transport services for emergencies within their borders, and MCA centralize two or three ECHO type units to take paramedics to the calls if ALS is needed.  I can envision having to take our ambulance (Deerfield Twp., or Riga, or BlissfieldTwp for that matter) into Dundee, Summerfield or Whiteford to transport because MCA is not available.  Before I was on my department I know of a few instances where we responded to Cabela's with a Raisin Twp medic, to assist and transport for Dundee.  That should never happen, but it will start happening again if MCA has to transport all of the City's patients.
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rands

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #20 on: April 07, 2009, 11:07:56 PM »

the other way the city wants to supplement their fire dept is to use Monroe Twp and Frenchtown Twp fire Depts.  Both of these departments run volumes are going up.  They may not be available when the city needs them, or when they canmake the call, their response times may be longer.  Who will volunteer  their house to test this out, the mayor? Or how about the city mgr., oops I forgot he doesn't live in the city.  The bottom line is the mayor and the city council is playing God with the health and safety of the citezens of Monroe.
The nice thing about the city doing transport is that they only charge the insurance company, unlike MCA (HVA) they will go after you forthe remainder of the bill.  So not only will you pay taxes forthe fire department to respond, you will also pay for the unpaid portion of the ambulance bill that you racked up.  MCA billing can be as high as $700 to $900 for an ALS run (depending on what they do to you). I don't think that your health insurance or car insurance will pay the whole amount.  I know that medicare and medicaid will not pay that amount. Again who will get stuck paying the difference, you will.
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Ishkibibl

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #21 on: April 08, 2009, 09:16:47 AM »

the other way the city wants to supplement their fire dept is to use Monroe Twp and Frenchtown Twp fire Depts.  Both of these departments run volumes are going up.  They may not be available when the city needs them, or when they canmake the call, their response times may be longer.  Who will volunteer  their house to test this out, the mayor? Or how about the city mgr., oops I forgot he doesn't live in the city.  The bottom line is the mayor and the city council is playing God with the health and safety of the citezens of Monroe.
The nice thing about the city doing transport is that they only charge the insurance company, unlike MCA (HVA) they will go after you forthe remainder of the bill.  So not only will you pay taxes forthe fire department to respond, you will also pay for the unpaid portion of the ambulance bill that you racked up.  MCA billing can be as high as $700 to $900 for an ALS run (depending on what they do to you). I don't think that your health insurance or car insurance will pay the whole amount.  I know that medicare and medicaid will not pay that amount. Again who will get stuck paying the difference, you will.

And, adding to the above comment, just how long do you think Monroe Twp and/or Frenchtown will subsidize the city?  If they run so many of the 3000+ calls the city runs, who will be left to cover their area?  I can forsee the county mutual aid agreement being looked at again very seriously, if 1 dept has to run the calls of another, at least without any type of subsidation.  So then where ar e the savings?  And, if MCA needs to add another car ot two, being a non-profit organization, will need a subsidy from Monroe County.  And do you not think Monroe County will go after the City of Monroe if they are being covered by mCA also?  on't think so
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Professor H

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #22 on: April 08, 2009, 12:34:48 PM »

Bingo on the points you all have raised in the past few posts...

The sad part is that in the fire service - you respond when called,  and politicians don't really care if you have enough to do the job.   You still do it....
Remember there is no State or County Fire Dept to call upon,  only your neighbors.

Someday you may see a County Department like California, Florida...   or even Traverse City region
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rands

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #23 on: April 08, 2009, 01:00:52 PM »

The reason that the city goes out of its boundaries so often is due to medical control.  The city was forced to sign a mutual aid agreement if it wanted permission to operate an ALS transporting service in the county.  I don't agree with it, I feel that they should look after their own first. If Frenchtown needs them then let Frenchtown call for them, not MCA.  Frenchtown has a couple of BLS transporting units. If needed the city could call them for transport. I believe that the city has ALS engines, just use Frenchtown for transport and split the money collected.
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Professor H

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #24 on: April 08, 2009, 03:02:50 PM »

The reason that the city goes out of its boundaries so often is due to medical control.  The city was forced to sign a mutual aid agreement if it wanted permission to operate an ALS transporting service in the county.  I don't agree with it, I feel that they should look after their own first. If Frenchtown needs them then let Frenchtown call for them, not MCA.  Frenchtown has a couple of BLS transporting units. If needed the city could call them for transport. I believe that the city has ALS engines, just use Frenchtown for transport and split the money collected.

Nobody is considering the study done a few years ago that called for the City and Frenchtown to merge as a cost savings.   but then that would take away the City Managers ability to rob the money that was meant for fire services to use for his pet projects and services
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The Maniacal Joker

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #25 on: April 08, 2009, 05:42:49 PM »

Monroe City Firefighters, Local 326 Ask…
Are You Willing to Risk the Lives of Your Family?

YOUR CITY COUNCIL IS!

Here’s what City Council and Mayor are planning for YOUR Fire Department…

•   More Job Eliminations
•   Station Closings
•   Decreased Emergency Services
•   Unsafe Staffing Numbers at Fires
•   Increased Emergency Response Times
And All of This at NO tax savings to YOU!


Did You Know…?

•   Since 1992, the City of Monroe’s medical calls have tripled.
•   In 2000, Mayor Worrell made all the motions to start the Advanced Life Support Program.
•   In 2000, your Monroe Firefighters started an Advanced Life Support service to serve you better.  Now your city council members and Mayor want to eliminate it.
•   85% of all emergency calls are medical based.
•   Every Monroe City Firefighter is also a Paramedic.
•   Your Fire Department was already cut 25% in 2008; Council wants to cut it 33% more in 2009. That’s half of your Fire Department in ONE YEAR.
•   Our Fire Chief recommended to City council that he wants to close your East Side Fire Station.
•   East side residents could wait up to 10 minutes for their first fire truck.
•   Your Fire Department’s average response time is 3-4 minutes; the proposed replacement ambulance has a response time average of 10-12 minutes urban and 15 minutes rurally.

When Seconds Count - You Count On Us
CAN WE COUNT ON YOU?

For any additional information please visit
Monroefirefighters.org

 

It is not too late!!

If You are Concerned About the Safety of
You and Your Loved Ones…


Contact Your Council Person and Tell Them NOT To Close Your East Side Fire Station or Eliminate the Advanced Life Support Services…
Once They Close the East Side Station, Your West Side Station May Be Next
Once Your Ambulances Are Gone, What Will Be Next…?

 
Mayor Mark G. Worrell
Home   734-457-4053
Cell      734-231-0789

City Manager George Brown
Home    517-266-1063

Councilman Robert Clark      
Cell      734-735-1971

Councilman Ed Paisley
Cell      734-735-2151
   
Councilman Kelvin McGhee         
Cell    734-770-3214

Councilman Jeremy J. Molenda
Cell      734-731-4170

Councilwoman Mary Conner
Home    734-241-3710
Cell    734-731-1333

Councilman Brian Beneteau
Home    734-457-4348
Cell    734-735-1388
 
Please Attend Your Council Meetings With Us and Express Your Thoughts And Fears About Your Safety To Your City Council Members.


UPCOMING COUNCIL MEETINGS

•   April 20th @ 7:30 pm
Final Budget Approval


Find Out Just Where Your Tax Dollars Are Being Spent…!
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eriemermaid

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #26 on: April 08, 2009, 06:59:07 PM »

You know joker, this is just wrong.  They are not planning on closing stations.  It is just one station.  Yes it is on the east end, but the other station on the east side of town is still going to be open.   (E. 1st and ?Washington?)  The distance from one station to the other is definitely NOT even 5 minutes.  2 minutes max. 

If 85% of the calls are medical, why do they take those big fire trucks to every call?  Maybe they could invest in a mini van.  They could put all the equipment in the back and save on gas.   JMHO
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eriedearie

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #27 on: April 08, 2009, 07:34:55 PM »

firefighters are important,  so are police officers, who, by the way, are being killed daily.  Nurses, teachers, etc are being asked to "get by" on no increase in pay, no matching 401K, etc, etc.  what makes the fire department any different?
Tax base is decreasing.  Something has to give.
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BigRedDog

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #28 on: April 08, 2009, 07:43:33 PM »

You know joker, this is just wrong.  They are not planning on closing stations.  It is just one station.  Yes it is on the east end, but the other station on the east side of town is still going to be open.   (E. 1st and ?Washington?)  The distance from one station to the other is definitely NOT even 5 minutes.  2 minutes max. 

If 85% of the calls are medical, why do they take those big fire trucks to every call?  Maybe they could invest in a mini van.  They could put all the equipment in the back and save on gas.   JMHO

They take those big trucks just in case they do happen to get a fire call while they are away from the station.  Say they are on a medical call with your mini van down where they are proposing to close the east side station.  They get a fire call only a block away.  Now, they have to leave the medical call with at least part of the personnell and return to the station and pick up the big fire truck and then return to right where they were...  major loss of time...  what started as a small stove fire in the kitchen is now burning through the roof...   fire is what many refer to as "time sensitive"...   and sometimes they just may need a piece of equipment they only carry on the big trucks too...
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BigRedDog

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Re: City Budget Proposes 9 more Firefighters layoff/cut
« Reply #29 on: April 08, 2009, 07:46:12 PM »

firefighters are important,  so are police officers, who, by the way, are being killed daily.  Nurses, teachers, etc are being asked to "get by" on no increase in pay, no matching 401K, etc, etc.  what makes the fire department any different?
Tax base is decreasing.  Something has to give.

I would imagine more firefighters die in the line of duty every year than policemen, but that is not the issue here anyway I don't believe...

You are correct that "everyone" should be asked to give "some"...   

the firefighters contention is that they gave last year when no one else did and are now being asked to give again along with "some other"....
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