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[gossipcolumn]

I guess ramming a squad Car is reason enough to kill someone.  Someone as vicious as that deserves to die.  Just another good example of Cops thinking they are the Judge and Jury.

[Normal Joe]

If you want to play...you got to pay.....

[Frenchfry]

Well I’m glad I didn’t start this topic but her crimes didn’t warrant the death penalty.

She was very lucky the windshield deflected the bullets.

So if anyone bumps my car I should assume they are trying to kill me and I have the right to use deadly force right?

I have some things to do but I’ll respond to the law enforcement cheerleading onslaught later.

[BigRedDog]

Well ff...

Until the officer who did the shooting can get a little smaller "grouping" of his shots I don't think we're in too much danger...   I suppose they might get in a "lucky shot" once in a while...

Picture on the front page tonight shows the two holes in the windshield at 3 or 4 feet apart.  If I was shooting at that size target and couldn't get my shots any closer than that...   I wouldn't want the picture on the front page.

[Frenchfry]

Here are the various updates to that story as they appeared on Monroenews.com, I just wanted to post them before they were relegated into the archives

BREAKING NEWS: Officer fires at driver who rams police cruiser
By: Ray Kisonas story updated November 01. 2007 1:38PM 

A Monroe police officer today fired twice at a driver who allegedly attempted to run him down as he stood in the street with his weapon drawn.

No one was injured in the incident that began around noon. The woman who sped away after the initial police contact was taken into custody in the 900 block of E. First St. in front of the Salvation Army.

The incident began as a domestic violence call in the 600 block of Conant Ave., and the woman reportedly fled from the scene at high speeds in a white Pontiac.

A police officer responding to the domestic call spotted the car speeding north on Railroad St. The officer was on E. Third St. and crossed the railroad tracks. He then used his patrol car to block the intersection, but the fleeing Pontiac rammed the cruiser, police reported.

At that point, the officer, an unnamed veteran of the force, got out with his weapon drawn and ordered the woman out of the car. Witnesses and police accounts said the woman drove toward the officer, who opened fire with his .45-caliber semi-automatic service handgun.

One bullet pierced the windshield on the driver's side at eye level. However, the bullet deflected downward and struck the top of the dash. The second bullet hit the windshield in the corner on the passenger side, police said.

Witness James Runyon was installing flooring in a house at Railroad and E. Third Sts. and saw the officer fire his weapon.

"He had his revolver out, and I seen him point the gun at the car," Mr. Runyon said. "He was pointing right at the windshield. He was hollering at her to turn the car off. Two shots then went off."

The woman left the scene, and the officer pursued. She reportedly drove erratically and at high speeds in her apparent attempt to escape and might have struck some parked cars. She ended up heading east on E. First St. An officer, believed to be the same one who fired his gun, used his squad car to force her to stop and took the woman into custody without further incident.

"The whole thing was probably over in three minutes," said Lt. Gary Werner.

Police were gathering evidence at both scenes. At E. Third and Railroad, police used yellow tape to cordon off the section where the cars collided. Two bullet casings and a shattered wheel cover were in the street.

At the second scene where the arrest was made, the damaged squad car came to rest against the Pontiac. Two bullet holes could be clearly seen in the windshield. Both passenger-side door windows in the Pontiac also were shattered.

Further details are being gathered this afternoon.

Police shoot at driver after confrontation; no one hurt
   By: Ray Kisonas story updated November 02. 2007 11:31AM 


A woman who was shot at by a Monroe police officer had a physical confrontation with a neighbor, police said, and was acting irrationally just before she fled that scene and reportedly rammed her speeding car into a police cruiser Thursday morning.

Police believe the suspect was drunk when she allegedly drove her car toward the officer, who was pointing his gun at her demanding that she stop. Instead, reports say, the 24-year-old woman accelerated toward the veteran officer who then fired his service weapon twice, hitting the windshield with both rounds. The woman was not hit and both she and the officer escaped injury.

Today, the suspect, who remains jailed, was expected to be charged with numerous crimes for causing problems with a neighbor and for allegedly attempting to run down the officer, whose name is not being released at this time.

Monroe Police Chief John Michrina said the officer acted appropriately.

"Anytime your car is rammed twice, you're in danger of being hit," the chief said. "Everyone who was out on the streets was in danger of being hit."

The incident began shortly before 11:30 a.m. when a woman called police to complain that the suspect came to her house in the 600 block of Conant Ave. and threw a small statue at her, striking her in the face. The victim in that case told police she knows the suspect from the neighborhood.

According to police reports, the suspect came to the victim's door and asked for a person who did not live there. She then asked to use the victim's restroom and was let inside. The suspect then stole some small statues, reports said.

On the porch, the suspect began yelling and hurled one of the statues through the front window. She then threw another statue at the victim, hitting her in the face and causing injury. Police said a confrontation occurred and the suspect fled the scene at high speeds.

Police then began responding to the Conant Ave. address. However, the suspect was spotted by one of the officers driving a white Pontiac down Railroad St. at high speeds. The officer involved in the shooting was heading east on E. Third St. and used his squad car to block the intersection at Railroad.

The suspect allegedly rammed the cruiser twice. The officer got out with his weapon drawn and ordered the woman out of the car. Witnesses and police accounts said the woman drove at the officer, who opened fire with his .45-caliber semiautomatic service handgun.

One bullet pierced the windshield on the driver's side at eye level, but was deflected downward and struck the top of the dash. The second bullet hit the windshield in the corner on the passenger side.

James Runyon was installing flooring in a house at the corner of Railroad and E. Third and said he saw the officer fire his weapon.

"He had his revolver out and I seen him point the gun at the car," Mr. Runyon said. "He was pointing right at the windshield. He was hollering at her to turn the car off. Two shots then went off. It was ‘pop, pop.'"

From there, police say the woman fled again and the officer pursued. She drove erratically and at high speeds and reportedly struck at least two parked cars in the process. She made her way to E. First St., where the pursuing officer used his squad car to force her to stop.

The woman, who police said was screaming and reeked of intoxicants, was taken custody without further incident.

"Obviously, her actions were bizarre," Chief Michrina said. "We don't know what her motivations were."

Shortly after the shots were fired, police used yellow tape to cordon off the section where the cars collided at E. Third and Railroad. Two bullet casings and a shattered wheel cover were in the street.

At the second scene where the arrest was made, the damaged squad car came to rest against the Pontiac, which had Iowa license plates. Two bullet holes were clearly visible in the windshield. Both passenger-side windows in the Pontiac were shattered.

Police are continuing the investigation. Chief Michrina said the officer, a corporal with many years on the force, will continue to work on the road.

"He's not on administrative leave," the chief said. "There's no need for it under the circumstances."

Monroe Township driver charged after shooting
story updated November 03. 2007 1:28AM


The woman who apparently drove a car at a police officer, forcing him to open fire, was charged Friday with five crimes including two felonies.

Melissa A. Folmar, 24, of 15377 S. Telegraph Rd., No. 43, was remanded to the county jail after failing to post a $50,000 bond.

She stood before First District Judge Mark S. Braunlich on charges of fleeing and eluding and assault with a dangerous weapon, both felonies.

The charges were in connection with her purposely driving a Pontiac at a Monroe police officer who fired twice in his defense, according to police reports. The bullets hit the car's windshield; no one was injured.

The shooting happened on Railroad St. at E. Third St. shortly before noon Thursday. Ms. Folmar reportedly was fleeing the scene of an assault and theft at a house on Conant Ave. when she encountered the police officer, who blocked the intersection with his squad car.

Ms. Folmar is accused of stealing some statues from a Conant Ave. house and throwing two of them. One went through a window and a second struck a woman in the face, police said.

After that incident, Ms. Folmar fled the scene and rammed into the police car. After the shooting, the woman again fled in her car and eventually was captured on E. First St.

The defendant also was charged with larceny of less than $200, malicious destruction of property of less than $200 and assault and battery. Bond on those misdemeanors was set at $500.

A pretrial examination has been set for Nov. 13.

[A Reasonable Person]

Well I’m glad I didn’t start this topic but her crimes didn’t warrant the death penalty.

She was very lucky the windshield deflected the bullets.

So if anyone bumps my car I should assume they are trying to kill me and I have the right to use deadly force right?

I have some things to do but I’ll respond to the law enforcement cheerleading onslaught later.

You used the word "bumps"    This is a common French Fry tactic to down play the incident.  The correct word is "ram."  And she didn't ram the police car once.  She rammed it twice.  - According to the article the officer got out of his car and ordered the female to stop.  I assume he was using loud verbal commands.  It was 11:30am in the daylight so i assume the officer was clearly able to be seen as a police officer.
She accelerates her car towards the officer after she "rammed" his patrol vehicle twice.
Officer shoots and tries to flee the attack.  (Thus the large space between the groups in the bullets.)
She then proceeds to drive her 2000lbs bullet through city streets "ramming" into cars all allong the streets as she goes untill the police area able to "ram" her back and pin her between other vehicles (as seen in the photograph).  It is the middle of the day, and I have no doubt that her actions were a direct threat to public safety.  There is alot of pedestrian and vehicle traffic in that area during the day time.  Does she have to run someone over before the police are allowed to defend themselves?

"Ramming" a police car or any car is called Felonious Assault.

I know my posting here is probably pointless because all of us at MonroeTalks has learned by now that there is absolutely nothing the police can do that will satisfy our esteemed poster, Mr French Fry. 

[jahadmin]

I think that the officer was within his rights.  I'm happy that she didn't get killed in the process but she was in the wrong.  Maybe she will think twice before doing something this stupid.  FF, I hope you never need the help of the fine Monroe Police Department.  These along with the local fire men and women our their to protect us and I think that they do a great job. 

[Frenchfry]

“The suspect allegedly rammed the cruiser twice”

I’ll bet she was just trying to get away and didn’t actually aim for the officer.

I’m sure there must have been other options other than shooting to kill.

The officer may have been within his rights but I don’t believe his actions were the right thing to do.

[A Reasonable Person]

“The suspect allegedly rammed the cruiser twice”

They always use the words allegedly in news paper articles because to say otherwise will hamper the innocent until proven guilty thought.

I’ll bet she was just trying to get away and didn’t actually aim for the officer.

You weren't there but you can place a bet if you want.  I wasn't there either but i'd like to assume that what the MEN prints is pretty factual.

I’m sure there must have been other options other than shooting to kill.

police dont "shoot to kill"    they shoot to stop the threat.

The officer may have been within his rights but I don’t believe his actions were the right thing to do.

Fair enough.  thats an honest opinion.

[munrow]

Well I’m glad I didn’t start this topic

I think you did.

[munrow]

Well ff...

Until the officer who did the shooting can get a little smaller "grouping" of his shots I don't think we're in too much danger...   I suppose they might get in a "lucky shot" once in a while...

Picture on the front page tonight shows the two holes in the windshield at 3 or 4 feet apart.  If I was shooting at that size target and couldn't get my shots any closer than that...   I wouldn't want the picture on the front page.

That's easy to say from the comfort of your living room. I've never had to shoot at a moving vehicle that I thought was trying to run me down so I'm not sure how my grouping would have looked.

[Boylanjl]

The Monroe Police Officer was well within his rights to protect his life and the life of innocent civilians in the area.  He used appropriate force that this situation warranted.  As the MPD Chief was quoted saying "Anytime your car is rammed twice, you're in danger of being hit," the chief said. "Everyone who was out on the streets was in danger of being hit."  I feel it is safe to assume the young woman rammed the police cruiser twice.  I believe if this woman being under the influence (alledgedly) is the main factor in this whole incident.   She is very lucky the first bullet that deflected off the windshiled did not strike her.  We all know that certain people will always say that whatever the police do is an overreaction and tear apart evertything they do.  What must be remembered is that to truly say what this officer did was wrong, we should walk a mile in his shoes and be put in this situation. 

[sue lee]

They always use the words allegedly in news paper articles because to say otherwise will hamper the innocent until proven guilty thought.

You weren't there but you can place a bet if you want.  I wasn't there either but i'd like to assume that what the MEN prints is pretty factual.

police dont "shoot to kill"    they shoot to stop the threat.

Fair enough.  thats an honest opinion.

You are wrong, police do shoot to kill. When an officer pulls his weapon and aims it at you, he is taught to shoot to kill.

[belladonna]

You are wrong, police do shoot to kill. When an officer pulls his weapon and aims it at you, he is taught to shoot to kill. ----Sue Lee


I just ran downstairs and asked my father (retired cop) if this statement was true.  A police office may be "taught to shoot to kill" but that does not mean every time he pulls his weapon that is what his intent is.  

[A Reasonable Person]

You are wrong, police do shoot to kill. When an officer pulls his weapon and aims it at you, he is taught to shoot to kill.

No Sue, you are wrong, Police shoot to because it is necessary to immediately stop the threat....unfortunately the end result has the high potential for death.

Being run over by a vehicle also has the high potential to cause death.  So it does not seem unreasonable for the officer to respond with deadly force.  Whether it is a .45 caliber bullet or a 2000lbs vehicle....being struck by either is likely to cause death or serious injury.  So in retrospect the officer responded appropriately and proportionately to the situation.

What gave the woman the right to put everyone in danger?


The Use of Deadly Force
Definition:  That force which a person uses for the purpose of causing - or which he knows or should reasonably know, would create substantial risk of causing - death or serious bodily harm.

Deadly Force is justified under conditions of extreme necessity and only as a last resort when all lesser means have failed or cannot reasonably be employed.  It is used only as a last resort.


It sounds like the woman used deadly force on the officer thus he responded back with deadly force....