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zard0z

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[ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« on: November 10, 2007, 04:18:42 PM »

[ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
Tuesday, November 13 at 8pm ET/PT on PBS
Check your local listings as dates and times may vary.
Broadcast in High Definition where available

In 2004, the school board of Dover, Pennsylvania ordered the town's science teachers to read a statement to high school biology students suggesting that there is an alternative to Darwin's theory of evolution called intelligent design—the idea that life is too complex to have evolved naturally and therefore must have been designed by an intelligent agent. The teachers refused to comply. Later, parents opposed to intelligent design filed a lawsuit in federal court accusing the school board of violating the constitutional separation of church and state.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/id/

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marilyn.monroe

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2007, 07:06:25 AM »

Maybe they should have two science classes, one for the intelligent and one for those whose parents oppose free thought.
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Greg Chamberlain

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2007, 08:54:53 AM »

Intelligent design belongs in a philosophy class, not science class.
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marilyn.monroe

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2007, 10:19:47 AM »

Intelligent design belongs in a philosophy class, not science class.
Well maybe they should bump Darwinism over to philosophy class, too.

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lordfly

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #4 on: November 11, 2007, 12:22:03 PM »

Well maybe they should bump Darwinism over to philosophy class, too.

As well as the theory of gravity?

You can observe evolution in a science lab. You cannot observe ID in a science lab.
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marilyn.monroe

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #5 on: November 11, 2007, 02:38:09 PM »

As well as the theory of gravity?

You can observe evolution in a science lab. You cannot observe ID in a science lab.

I thot gravity was a law...you want to go there again?
Evolution isn't Darwinism...now is it?
When the students ask where did the material for the big bang come from...what do you propose they be told? My children have been taught to question, and I have an answer for that question, but science doesn't. The answer is God created it.
So, you have your beliefs and I have mine.
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lordfly

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #6 on: November 11, 2007, 03:49:26 PM »

I thot gravity was a law...you want to go there again?
Evolution isn't Darwinism...now is it?

Are you insinuating that Darwinism is a religion? Can you point me to the Church of the Latter Day Darwins, please?

There's no such thing as an 1850's era Darwinist thinker today. Darwin came up with the initial theory, and other people refined it, turning it into evolution.

You know, like gravity.


Quote
When the students ask where did the material for the big bang come from...what do you propose they be told?

What does this have to do with evolution? Nothing. At all. Evolution doesn't explain where the universe came from. It merely tries to explain where life comes from.



Quote
My children have been taught to question, and I have an answer for that question, but science doesn't. The answer is God created it.

Which is like saying "because I said so." Science doesn't just shrug its shoulders and go "well, I dunno, God did it."

Quote
So, you have your beliefs and I have mine.

I have my facts and you have my facts too.
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marilyn.monroe

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #7 on: November 11, 2007, 08:19:26 PM »

Are you insinuating that Darwinism is a religion? Can you point me to the Church of the Latter Day Darwins, please?

There's no such thing as an 1850's era Darwinist thinker today. Darwin came up with the initial theory, and other people refined it, turning it into evolution.

You know, like gravity.


What does this have to do with evolution? Nothing. At all. Evolution doesn't explain where the universe came from. It merely tries to explain where life comes from.



Which is like saying "because I said so." Science doesn't just shrug its shoulders and go "well, I dunno, God did it."

I have my facts and you have my facts too.

You don't want to talk about gravity, because you can't deal with the fact Newton was a religious man, who believed in God.
Darwinism has become many things to many people. It finds its roots in the theories of evolution and natural selection.
Evolution does not disprove Creationism, and as you say, evolution does not explain how our world was created.
I have your opinion, and you have mine.
 :)
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marilyn.monroe

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #8 on: November 11, 2007, 08:50:49 PM »

Let me try to shed some light as to why Christians may want Intelligent Design or Creationism touched on in Science class. From my own experience as a parent, it doesn't seem like the science teachers are just presenting the facts of science to our children, they go farther and dismiss God and religion. That crosses the line with me. They should keep their opinions on religion or lack thereof out of it. I do believe in the course of an education, many different discussions on many religions will be and should be had. If a student wants to question the science presented to them, or agree with it, good, let the teacher keep their opinion out of it.
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Greg Chamberlain

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #9 on: November 11, 2007, 08:58:45 PM »

Evolution does not disprove Creationism, and as you say, evolution does not explain how our world was created.

Evolution can not disprove creationism because creationism is not science. Evolution is science and as such should be taught in science class. Now if you want to debate philosophy, then be my guest but it doesn't belong in science class.
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"To preserve the freedom of the human mind then and freedom of the press, every spirit should be ready to devote itself to martyrdom; for as long as we may think as we will, and speak as we think, the condition of man will proceed in improvement." - Thomas Jefferson

marilyn.monroe

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2007, 09:17:36 PM »

Evolution can not disprove creationism because creationism is not science. Evolution is science and as such should be taught in science class. Now if you want to debate philosophy, then be my guest but it doesn't belong in science class.
The National Science Teachers Association (NSTA) Position Statement on The Freedom to Teach and the Freedom to Learn (adopted by the NSTA Board of Directors in July 1985) states in point one:

As professionals, teachers must be free to examine controversial issues openly in the classroom. The right to examine controversial issues is based on the democratic commitment to open inquiry and on the importance of decision-making involving opposing points of view and the free examination of ideas. The teacher is professionally obligated to maintain a spirit of free inquiry, open-mindedness and impartiality in the classroom. Informed diversity is a hallmark of democracy to be protected, defended, and valued. (Emphasis added.)

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Greg Chamberlain

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #11 on: November 11, 2007, 09:55:06 PM »

That's fine, but keep it in the appropriate class. Math class is not the place to debate plato. Keep religion out of science.
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"To preserve the freedom of the human mind then and freedom of the press, every spirit should be ready to devote itself to martyrdom; for as long as we may think as we will, and speak as we think, the condition of man will proceed in improvement." - Thomas Jefferson

christfollower

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #12 on: November 11, 2007, 10:52:00 PM »

Well maybe they should bump Darwinism over to philosophy class, too.



This would make sense since it's only an unproven theory as some would suggest intellegent design is.
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christfollower

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #13 on: November 11, 2007, 10:54:38 PM »

You don't want to talk about gravity, because you can't deal with the fact Newton was a religious man, who believed in God.
Darwinism has become many things to many people. It finds its roots in the theories of evolution and natural selection.
Evolution does not disprove Creationism, and as you say, evolution does not explain how our world was created.
I have your opinion, and you have mine.
 :)

AMEN I could not have said it better myself. Bravo Ms. Monroe Bravo
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lordfly

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Re: [ON NOVA] Judgment Day: Intelligent Design on Trial
« Reply #14 on: November 12, 2007, 08:20:31 AM »

This would make sense since it's only an unproven theory as some would suggest intellegent design is.

How is evolution an unproven theory? Have you ever gotten a cold?
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