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[Frenchfry]

LOL...the right-wing climate change deniers bought the opinions of a few people willing to prostitute themselves for a buck.
The righties of MT are clear proof of the influence of big money...although a lifetime of indoctrination may have damaged their critical thinking to the point that ignoring facts in favor of propaganda from the right has become the norm for those parrots.

Spencer is an anthropogenic global warming denier who believes that climate change is not human caused and will have minimal impact.
Spencer is on the nine-member board of the antiregulation, Scaife- and Bradley-funded Marshall Institute.
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Roy_Spencer

Stephen McIntyre is the primary author of the blog Climate Audit, noted for its many articles skeptical of climate change. He is a prominent critic of scientific studies of temperature records of the past 1000 years that show increasing global temperatures.
McIntyre was also a headliner at the Heartland Institute's International Conference on Climate Change, a gathering of climate change skeptics.
McIntyre is, according to the Wall Street Journal, a "semiretired Toronto minerals consultant" who has spent "two years and about $5,000 of his own money trying to double-check the influential graphic" known as the "hockey stick" that illustrates a reconstruction of average surface temperatures in the Northern hemisphere, created by University of Virginia climatologist Michael Mann. He does not have an advanced degree and has published two articles in the journal Energy and Environment, which has become a venue for skeptics and is not carried in the ISI listing of peer-reviewed journals.
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Steve_McIntyre

[Frenchfry]

Extreme weather events forecast storm over climate change denial
>snippets<
Evidence supporting the existence of climate change is pummeling the United States this summer, from the mountain wildfires of Colorado to the recent "derecho" storm that left at least 23 dead and 1.4 million people without power from Illinois to Virginia. The phrase "extreme weather" flashes across television screens from coast to coast, but its connection to climate change is consistently ignored, if not outright mocked.

More than 2,000 heat records were broken last week around the US. The National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA), the government agency that tracks the data, reported that the spring of 2012 "marked the largest temperature departure from average of any season on record for the contiguous United States". These record temperatures in May, NOAA says, "have been so dramatically different that they establish a new 'neighborhood' apart from the historical year-to-date temperatures".
More here:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/jul/05/extreme-weather-forecast-storm-climate-change

Still don’t believe in climate change? Then you’re either deep in denial or delirious from the heat.

As I write this, the nation’s capital and its suburbs are in post-apocalypse mode. About one-fourth of all households have no electricity, the legacy of an unprecedented assault by violent thunderstorms Friday night. Things are improving: At the height of the power outage, nearly half the region was dark.

The line of storms, which killed at least 18 people as it raced from the Midwest to the sea, culminated a punishing day when the official temperature here reached 104 degrees, a record for June. Hurricane-force winds wreaked havoc with the lush tree canopy that is perhaps Washington’s most glorious amenity. One of my neighbors was lucky when a huge branch, headed for his roof, got snagged by a power line. Another neighbor lost a tree that fell into another tree that smashed an adjacent house, demolishing the second floor.

Yes, it’s always hot here in the summer – but not this hot. Yes, we always have thunderstorms – but never like these. (The cliché is true: It did sound like a freight train.)

According to scientists, climate change means not only that we will see higher temperatures but that there will be more extreme weather events like the one we just experienced. Welcome to the rest of our lives.

The problem for those who dismiss climate change as a figment of scientists’ imagination, or even as a crypto-socialist one-worldish plot to take away our God-given SUVs, is that the data are beginning to add up.

The National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration says the past winter was the fourth-warmest on record in the United States. To top that, spring – which meteorologists define as the months of March, April and May – was the warmest since recordkeeping began in 1895. If you don’t believe me or the scientists, ask a farmer whose planting seasons have gone awry.

NASA’s Goddard Institute for Space Studies, which monitors global surface temperatures, reports that nine of the warmest 10 years on record have occurred since 2000. The warmest of all was 2010; last year was only the ninth-warmest, but global temperatures were still almost a full degree warmer than they were during the middle of the 20th century.

More here:
http://www.delawareonline.com/article/20120707/OPINION16/307070011/Scientists-farmers-know-climate-change-isn-t-cool?odyssey=mod|newswell|text|Opinion|p

[Professor H]

LOL...the right-wing climate change deniers bought the opinions of a few people willing to prostitute themselves for a buck.
The righties of MT are clear proof of the influence of big money...although a lifetime of indoctrination may have damaged their critical thinking to the point that ignoring facts in favor of propaganda from the right has become the norm for those parrots.

So now Billionaires are responsible for Climate changes instead of good ole Mother Nature and the Universe (Sun, moon, planets)...

Nice try  - come back when your data is less biased (tree ring - interpretations), and includes more than a few years on a planet that is Billions of years old... 

[old salt]

There have been 372,989 correctly recorded daily high temperature records in the US since 1895.  84% of them were set when CO2 was below 350ppm.

Source:UNITED STATES HISTORICAL CLIMATOLOGY NETWORK

[marilyn.monroe]

The Earth has warmed and cooled. That doesn't mean man isn't destroying it with pollution! Humans may or may not tip the scales climate-wise, but we still have to think about sustaining the Earth for future generations!

How does anyone know Mars wasn't destroyed by living creatures?

[Baby Hitler]

There have been 372,989 correctly recorded daily high temperature records in the US since 1895.  84% of them were set when CO2 was below 350ppm.

Source:UNITED STATES HISTORICAL CLIMATOLOGY NETWORK

So 16% of our high temperature records, (Higher than those even in the past 100 years) are now in the last 20 years


Guessing you won't even change your mind when that number reaches 100%

[ducksoup]

There have been 372,989 correctly recorded daily high temperature records in the US since 1895.  84% of them were set when CO2 was below 350ppm.

Source:UNITED STATES HISTORICAL CLIMATOLOGY NETWORK

Umm, so...    This past two week set new ALL TIME never ever recorded there high temperatures for ANY day, not just THAT day. 

[marilyn.monroe]

Fermi is an example of how industry can change the climate. Here is an old report I found interesting. Any new info on it would be appreciated.

https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:9QPhq4nvQzcJ:deepblue.lib.umich.edu/bitstream/2027.42/5205/5/bac3781.0001.001.pdf+fermi+monroe&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESgZMQFqN9D0jHDMwwJWaexFyPSxZ6wFtwE0DWqZXz9R-6VovzmE1Iuyg4fMPe4GKWV4dWydlCoq_jdHnd9-O1oLGmIVjK0k2qRU5vHCAHA7abGlA28McpLqS22wCGSzJScMeqaD&sig=AHIEtbTUv6S42j-3huCUvy5EN9V_-dbl9Q

The Prediction of Prolonged Temperature Inversions Near the Western Shore of Lake Erie
Maurice E. Graves
Technical Report No. 6
ORA PROJECT 03632
THE UNIVERSITY OF MICHIGAN
ANN ARBOR, MICHIGAN
November 1962

[old salt]

FB,
Which number are you referring too?  Not that it matters.  It won't change my mind.  Junk science is junk science.  Science by consensus is not science.

Duck,
ANY day you say?  And how far back does this data go.......
Not back far enough to mean a dang thing.

As the Prof mentioned earlier in this post, we can find data and articles to dispute everything you claim about the climate.  It's all a way to take my money and give it to someone else to further a non-existant problem with unworkable solutions.

So 16% of our high temperature records, (Higher than those even in the past 100 years) are now in the last 20 years


Guessing you won't even change your mind when that number reaches 100%

[Forsythia]

FB,
Which number are you referring too?  Not that it matters.  It won't change my mind.  Junk science is junk science.  Science by consensus is not science.

Duck,
ANY day you say?  And how far back does this data go.......
Not back far enough to mean a dang thing.

As the Prof mentioned earlier in this post, we can find data and articles to dispute everything you claim about the climate.  It's all a way to take my money and give it to someone else to further a non-existant problem with unworkable solutions.

Wow....the ignorance is just astounding.  The science you call "junk science" is anything but that.  There is a direct, and obvious, correlation to increased green house gasses and inscreased temperature change.  That's basic scientific knowledge.  If you want to destroy the world and use up it's finite resources....well I can't say what I want to on that.

Do you realize that the earth is a finite resource?  Do you realize that there's only so much fossil fuel that will go around?  Do you realize that we're destroying our HOME at an insane rate?  That should be enough motivation for you people.  You're taking a dump on your own floors by not recognizing the FACTS that are climate change.  As far as I'm concerned you can crap all over your house, but if I'm living with you, I'm not going to let it happen. 

[Baby Hitler]

Not that it matters.  It won't change my mind.

Then why should I bother? It's obvious you've made your mind up, and no amount of data or statistical analysis or anything else will ever change your mind. If it really did matter, the number would be the amount of record temperatures (100%) that occurred AFTER the climate reached 350 ppmv of CO2.

As the Prof mentioned earlier in this post, we can find data and articles to dispute everything you claim about the climate.  It's all a way to take my money and give it to someone else to further a non-existant problem with unworkable solutions.

And as I stated, if the data that I have is garnered by over 90% of the scientists all over the globe, all being funded by big bad government(s), then the scientists that you have garnered are all being funded by oil conglomerates hell bent on making profits, and damn everyone who gets in their way.

By the way, do you believe in the Theory of Relativity?

Or do you believe in the Theory of Evolution?

Heliocentric theory?    the Earth orbits the Sun
Cell theory?    living things are made of cells
Atomic theory?  matter is composed of atoms

I mean, these are just theories right?

Theories acclaimed by most scientists as being the most likely of the theories that are presented, and have been for quite some time, yet can they be proven, or are they just science by consensus?

No matter, you've already stated that NOTHING will change your mind.

Ok, what PROOF is it that you require? Evidently, you have some idea of what empirical evidence that would finally make you believe.

What is it?

Your answer is NOTHING.

[ducksoup]

FB,
Which number are you referring too? Not that it matters. It won't change my mind. 

You are right, a closed mind is a closed mind and no amount of FACT will dissuade what you are told to think.

 

Junk science is junk science. Science by consensus is not science.

I was interested by this.  All of a sudden the right wing is all into the phrase “junk science”.  Turns out to be a Faux news origination crapola.  Nice that ya’all repeat blindly what faux tells you to.

Duck,
ANY day you say? And how far back does this data go.......
Not back far enough to mean a dang thing.

There ya go... since we have only recorded temperatures for a couple hundred years, then any day before that COULD have been hotter, but you forget that they might not have.  Just as possible.  But that many, many places are hotter than ever before SINCE WE RECORDED THEM then it means nothing to closed minds.

As the Prof mentioned earlier in this post, we can find data and articles to dispute everything you claim about the climate. It's all a way to take my money and give it to someone else to further a non-existant problem with unworkable solutions.

So, your doctor says you have what looks like skin cancer and you disagree, go to 200 doctors that also agree with the first, that is just junk science by consensus according to you.  Then you finally find one that says it could be just a mole and whoppee you were right.  Then you die of skin cancer... See, that’s the thing, if we all listen to those with closed minds, then we do nothing.  If we attempt to do something we might head off what is happening.  The difference is clear, do nothing and the cost could be the extinction of the human race.  Do something and the cost could be money.  OMG  money is more than people so the answer is clear.

[eriemermaid]

Well, I don't know about all you people on this thread but there has been no climate change in my yard for days!  It has been hot and sticky day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day after day. 

[old salt]

If we attempt to do something we might head off what is happening.  The difference is clear, do nothing and the cost could be the extinction of the human race.  Do something and the cost could be money.  OMG  money is more than people so the answer is clear.

"If we attempt to do something".......................like what?

"to head off what is happening".........................what is happening?

I've had this discussion with Baggins:

http://monroetalks.com/forum/index.php?topic=25128.15

Here's one post:
------------------------------
I can't see any problems. Yet you can't identify the problem, or the solution, or the cost.

You see it as:
Problem - climate change
Solution - Don't burn fossil fuels, use 1 sheet of tp.
Cost - Fork over whatever you have left

I say we've been better guardians of the earth than ever before.  We're not belching out black smoke like we used to, nor are we dumping into the rivers anymore (or not as much).  We recycle. And the preventative maintenance list goes on. 

But to say the global temperature change of whatever teeny number you come up with is a problem, and I say it's not. 

Solution - We've spent billions and 40+ years trying to justify wind and solar.  It's just not there yet (economically practical).  When it is, we'll embrace it.

Cost - you can't put a cost to this issue.  Period.  And you have no way of knowing if anything we do will change a thing.  One solar flare, one volcanic eruption, one earthquake (Japanese flotsam?).  Any one of these natural disasters could change the earth's temperature.

Junk science.  That's all your promoting.  I'm not buying it. The earth is pretty resilient.
-------------------------------

I had extensive posts with Baggins.  I'm not going to rehash all the same stuff. And the so-called FACTS have been fudged beyond usefulness.

[ducksoup]

"If we attempt to do something".......................like what?

"to head off what is happening".........................what is happening?

I've had this discussion with Baggins:

http://monroetalks.com/forum/index.php?topic=25128.15

Here's one post:
------------------------------
I can't see any problems. Yet you can't identify the problem, or the solution, or the cost.

You see it as:
Problem - climate change
Solution - Don't burn fossil fuels, use 1 sheet of tp.
Cost - Fork over whatever you have left

The answer is simple for either side.  For you it is keep your head buried under the sand and repeat the lies of those you idolize.  For others it is to do something... anything other than play pretend nothing is wrong and the problem will just go away on its own. 

The cost is equally easy. Money or human life extinction.  What would you do if you were told you had cancer?  Would you spend all the money you had trying to reverse it, or would you just hoard your cash and die quick?  Please don’t answer that, I am too afraid of the answer.

I say we've been better guardians of the earth than ever before. We're not belching out black smoke like we used to, nor are we dumping into the rivers anymore (or not as much). We recycle. And the preventative maintenance list goes on.

Ahhh, so there it is, you are the expert and only one and your OPINION outweighs  all of those that studied their whole lives and know what they are talking about.  After all they disagree with your view of the sand under the ground so they are ALL wrong.

But to say the global temperature change of whatever teeny number you come up with is a problem, and I say it's not.

 
and you are betting the lives of everyone, and those that would have eventually been born on your under the sand opinion.

Solution - We've spent billions and 40+ years trying to justify wind and solar. It's just not there yet (economically practical). When it is, we'll embrace it.

Prove it.  Just because you CHOOSE to ignore fact, doesn’t mean it isn’t.

Cost - you can't put a cost to this issue. Period. And you have no way of knowing if anything we do will change a thing. One solar flare, one volcanic eruption, one earthquake (Japanese flotsam?). Any one of these natural disasters could change the earth's temperature.

Really? ? ?  That is what your so called NOT JUNK SCIENCE tells you?  That an earthquake can make the planet warmer year after year?  Your non junk science experts tell you that a single solar flare can raise temperatures of the whole planet every year and every next year?  Your not junk science experts tell you that a volcano will raise the temperature of the whole planet every year no matter how cold the volcano is now? 

Junk science. That's all your promoting. I'm not buying it. The earth is pretty resilient.

The right wing noise machine sure is pushing the “junk science” lies well.    Science by consensus... LOL  I guess that is why you float in space instead of stay on the ground.  That damn science of consensus is just junk science and gravity does not exist.  The hilarious thing is the ones claiming junk science use the REAL junk science.  But, if you had an open mind you would see that.  Whatever, you listen to your idols that tell you what to think and don’t you worry any over it.
-------------------------------

I had extensive posts with Baggins. I'm not going to rehash all the same stuff. And the so-called FACTS have been fudged beyond usefulness.

Yep, and no matter how good the facts, you still keep your closed mind firmly buried in the sand.