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Frenchfry

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #15 on: September 18, 2012, 12:25:07 PM »

Michigan urged to change benchmark health plan proposed under Affordable Care Act

A consumer health care group is calling for changes to the health insurance plan proposed to serve as a benchmark for plans offered in Michigan under the Affordable Care Act.

Michigan Consumers for Healthcare urged the state to include mental health parity and dental care for adults in its Essential Health Benefit plan, which will serve as the minimum coverage requirement for individual and small group plans that will be sold in Michigan starting in 2014.

More here:
http://www.mlive.com/news/index.ssf/2012/09/michigan_urged_to_change_bench.html
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Frenchfry

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #16 on: November 27, 2012, 11:34:56 PM »

Can't Afford Healthcare? Obamacare 'On the Table'

"After Mitt Romney lost on Election Day, it appeared that the health care law was here to stay. States are scrambling to meet federally-imposed deadlines to implement state exchanges and the administration announced coverage mandates. But House Speaker John Boehner signaled Tuesday that he is not giving up efforts to repeal the bill.

In an op-ed in the Cincinnati Enquirer, Boehner wrote that "we can't afford" the Affordable Care act, and said, "That's why I've been clear that the law has to stay on the table as both parties discuss ways to solve our nation's massive debt challenge."

Congress and the White House are involved in negotiations over the so-called "fiscal cliff." Spending cuts are a major component of the talks as Republicans are pushing for less spending in lieu of raising taxes. Boehner has spoken in general terms about his priorities for deficit reduction; this op-ed signals that health care is another element he wants thrown in the pot.

The Congressional Budget Office, however, has estimated that the cost of the main component of the health care law, the health insurance exchanges, will lower the government's share of health care costs because fewer people will be enrolled in the Medicaid program. Another CBO report says repealing the health care law would cost taxpayers $109 billion."*

Can't Afford Healthcare? Obamacare 'On the Table'
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"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative."
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Willful ignorance, PaTROLLing, bullying, dishonesty, and hypocrisy are among the traits that are common amongst those that espouse the Republican/Conservative/Tea Party ideology.

A non-response doesn't mean you've won, it merely means the obnoxious, illiterate, right-wing morons have taken too much of my time already.

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Frenchfry

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #17 on: November 27, 2012, 11:36:13 PM »

Drowning in 'Fear-Mongering Lies': Denny's, Papa John's Backtrack on 'Obamacare' After Backlash
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Willful ignorance, PaTROLLing, bullying, dishonesty, and hypocrisy are among the traits that are common amongst those that espouse the Republican/Conservative/Tea Party ideology.

A non-response doesn't mean you've won, it merely means the obnoxious, illiterate, right-wing morons have taken too much of my time already.

April 11, 2008
"French Fry, please come back."
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Frenchfry

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #18 on: November 27, 2012, 11:36:54 PM »

Obamacare: The Arrogant Stupidity of John Boehner in Display Over 'Fiscal Cliff' Talks
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"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative."
John Stuart Mill

Willful ignorance, PaTROLLing, bullying, dishonesty, and hypocrisy are among the traits that are common amongst those that espouse the Republican/Conservative/Tea Party ideology.

A non-response doesn't mean you've won, it merely means the obnoxious, illiterate, right-wing morons have taken too much of my time already.

April 11, 2008
"French Fry, please come back."
Dan Shaw (Managing Editor at Monroe Evening News)
That's right. Still the only one invited to be a member of the forum so suck it up jealous fools.

Frenchfry

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #19 on: November 27, 2012, 11:37:46 PM »

Petulant Republicans Refuse To Expand Medicaid, Create Obamacare Exchanges!

Petulant Republicans Refuse To Expand Medicaid, Create Obamacare Exchanges!
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"Although it is not true that all conservatives are stupid people, it is true that most stupid people are conservative."
John Stuart Mill

Willful ignorance, PaTROLLing, bullying, dishonesty, and hypocrisy are among the traits that are common amongst those that espouse the Republican/Conservative/Tea Party ideology.

A non-response doesn't mean you've won, it merely means the obnoxious, illiterate, right-wing morons have taken too much of my time already.

April 11, 2008
"French Fry, please come back."
Dan Shaw (Managing Editor at Monroe Evening News)
That's right. Still the only one invited to be a member of the forum so suck it up jealous fools.

Will Sweat

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #20 on: November 28, 2012, 06:45:05 AM »

I believe the Governors that are taking the stand against health care exchanges are doing so at the peril of there own states.  Health Care Reform is the law of the land and IMO, it sets a horrible precedent for a state official to not work to comply with the law. 

I also think the programs impact on the economy and working people is very unclear and would like a real understanding and accounting of what the program will cost.

IMO, regarding the current budget negotiations, everything should be considered - EVERYTHING. 

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blue2

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #21 on: November 28, 2012, 06:57:30 AM »

It's all nonsense that all people will be required to buy medical insurance.  The same number of people that get if for free now will continue to get it for free whether it's Medicaid or obamamcare.
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Will Sweat

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #22 on: November 28, 2012, 07:14:01 AM »

It's all nonsense that all people will be required to buy medical insurance.  The same number of people that get if for free now will continue to get it for free whether it's Medicaid or obamamcare.

Maybe.  But there is a large number of Americans that will now have health insurance that did not prior to this.  Additonally, there are extensions on "health care" that will be costly and those cost will be passed onto consumers. 

I, for one, am very concerned about the change in dynamic that this could drive within the workforce.  Like it or not business will do whatever is legal to ensure profit margins.  I think it is wrong to say businesses that have announced they will switch some of there workforces to part-time are doing so to demagogue or make a political statement.  Maybe some are but when you have hospitals, colleges and universities coming out and saying they will engage in this or similar practices then there must be some meat on the bone of that argument. 
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excelsior

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #23 on: November 28, 2012, 10:20:58 AM »

Post election obamacare regulations limit costs to elderly to 3 times the costs to the young while the true costs of elderly health is 6 times that of young folks.  In short, younger folks will pay higher premiums to subsidize lower costs for the elderly.



Want to Reduce Federal Spending? Repeal Obamacare's Steep Levies on Young People

more at:  http://www.forbes.com/sites/aroy/2012/11/21/want-to-reduce-federal-spending-repeal-obamacares-steep-levies-on-young-people/

Despite President Obama’s re-election, Republicans haven’t given up on resisting the implementation of Obamacare. They’ve proposed all sorts of ideas for opposing the law—some sound, some less so—but they’ve ignored one of the costliest provisions of Obamacare, one that will drastically increase the price of health insurance for young people. It’s called “community rating,” and it’s possibly the aspect of Obamacare that will do the most damage to the private insurance market.

Here’s how it works. Young people are, on average, much healthier than older people, and consume less health care services. Ordinarily, therefore, young people are much cheaper to insure than older people. Under free-market conditions—what insurance pros call experience rating—the typical 18-year-old costs one-sixth what it costs to insure the typical 64-year-old.

But Obamacare, in a sop to the AARP, requires that insurers only charge three times as much to their costliest beneficiaries what they charge to their least-costly ones. As the illustration below shows, this increases the cost of insurance for the young by 75 percent, while offering only a modest 13 percent subsidy to older Americans.

Optimists on the left shrug their shoulders and say it’s just fine for younger people to pay more so that older people pay less. But many young people will rightly look at this provision as a raw deal. If you go to the doctor once or twice a year, but are forced to pay $8,000 for your health insurance, why bother? And if young people drop out of the insurance market, older Americans will face higher—not lower—premiums than they would have under an experience-rated system.

What makes this doubly bad, in terms of policy, is that Obamacare spends trillions of dollars subsidizing the cost of insurance for the uninsured. And most people who are uninsured are young. In other words, Obamacare will more than double the cost of health insurance for many young people, and then the law will turn around and spend taxpayer dollars to subsidize the purchase of this newly costly insurance. Only in Washington does this make any sense.
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Professor H

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Hope and Exchange -
« Reply #24 on: November 28, 2012, 12:38:46 PM »


Hope and Exchange
The feds blame the states for refusing to become ObamaCare subsidiaries.

ObamaCare is due to land in a mere 10 months—about 300 days—and the Administration is not even close to ready, so naturally the political and media classes are attacking the Governors and state legislators who decline to help out. Mostly Republicans, they’re facing a torrent of abuse in Washington and pressure from health lobbies at home.

But the real story is that Democrats are reaping the GOP buy-in they earned. Liberals wanted government to re-engineer the entire health-care system and rammed the Affordable Care Act through on a party-line vote, not stopping to wonder whether it would work. Now that implementation is proving to be harder than advertised, they’re blaming the states for not making their jobs easier.

Editorial board member Joe Rago on HHS's extended deadline for states to implement health exchanges under ObamaCare and why many Republicans governors are refusing to.

The current rumpus is over ObamaCare’s “exchanges,” the bureaucracies that will regulate the design and sale of insurance and where 30 million people (and likely far more) will sign up for subsidized coverage. States were supposed to tell the Health and Human Services Department if they were going to set up and run an exchange by October, but HHS delayed the deadline to November, and then again at the 11th hour to December.

Sixteen states have already said they won’t participate. Another 11 are undecided, while only 17 have committed to doing the work on their own. Six have opted for a “hybrid” federal-state model. That means HHS will probably be responsible for fallback federal exchanges in full or in part in as many as 25 or 30 states.
***

The opposition isn’t so much political as practical. Or rather, the vast logistical and technical undertaking to build an exchange helps explain why so many Governors resisted ObamaCare in the first place.

States have regulated the small business and individual insurance markets for decades (some well, others less so). Now they’re supposed to toss everything out for a complex Washington rewrite, which is still being rewritten. The exchanges will also help enforce the individual mandate and premium increases. They’ll also have to spend a ton of money. Ohio estimates it will cost $63 million to set up an exchange and $43 million to run annually, based on a KPMG study.

Health and Human Services Secretary Kathleen Sebelius

Most spending will go to information technology, in an era when many states still run Medicaid using paper forms and pneumatic tubes. These systems are supposed to allow consumers to review health plans online (or in person and by mail and fax), pick one and then ping HHS and the Internal Revenue Service to determine who is eligible for what subsidies. Private businesses spend years developing and refining such consumer software. States need to fund call centers to field queries and even hire “navigators” to actively encourage people to enroll.

The main problem is that states are being conscripted as federal contractors. HHS has declined to reveal basic operational details except to make clear that state-based exchanges won’t really be run by the states. “No matter which option is chosen,” as Scott Walker put it, “Wisconsin taxpayers will not have meaningful control over the health-care policies and services sold to Wisconsin residents.”

So if things don’t work voters will blame the Governors for decisions made in Washington. And when it turns out that ObamaCare’s costs are underestimated and its benefits exaggerated, they’ll have enabled an entitlement that many of their constituents oppose. The wonder is that any GOP leaders—ahem, Chris Christie and Rick Scott—are still playing Hamlet.

Partly that may be due to the insurance and provider lobbies, especially the hospitals. They’re furious that states might spoil the deals they cut with the White House and frantic for new revenue, which will only flow with the subsidies. (Note that health industry stocks rallied on President Obama’s re-election.) They’re also generally more powerful at the local level and favor state-run exchanges as easier to manipulate. But Governors who give in are setting themselves up as political fall guys, just as the insurers will be when premiums inevitably spike.

We suggested at first that states could try to spin straw into gold, ignore HHS and try to adopt a marginally less destructive approach. One state that tried is Utah, which built an impartial insurance clearinghouse in 2009 based on “defined contribution, consumer choice, and free markets,” as Governor Gary Herbert put it in a November letter to HHS.

Now he’s asking Washington to accept “Utah’s version of a health insurance exchange,” even though it clearly does not comply with Affordable Care Act provisions. HHS claims it is trying to be flexible, so this will be a useful test.

But the main reason HHS and ObamaCare partisans are trashing the state hold-outs is that the federal government isn’t any better equipped to make the plan a success. HHS’s reputation as one of the most dysfunctional agencies is notorious. To take one example, an ObamaCare-mandated update to a major computer network called the System for Electronic Rate and Form Filing, which governs insurance approvals, has been delayed by months.

HHS’s bandwidth is likely to be fried and its personnel overloaded by the workload of 25 exchanges or even 16. And the effort will be complicated by the serious legal questions and eventual lawsuits about the statutory authority of a federal exchange to dispense subsidies at all.
***

The Affordable Care Act barely passed and then barely survived Supreme Court review and the 2012 election. Now the entitlement is hurtling toward a truth-in-advertising moment and liberals are terrified that it won’t produce the results they promised. That was always likely given the central planning architecture of ObamaCare, but now the likes of Mr. Walker are declining to do their work for them and depriving them of scapegoats.

The day after ObamaCare passed, we invoked the “Pottery Barn” rule that Colin Powell once applied to Iraq: You break it, you own it. Washington is about to break it, and the states are saying they won’t be accomplices.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887324556304578121012109574832.html?mod=googlenews_wsj
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blue2

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2012, 01:12:23 PM »

I don't get who it is that is going to have health insurance that doesn't have it now.  The people that can afford it have it now and those that live off the government still won't have money to buy health ins.  And that number is growing and will continue to grow.
Maybe it's the entitled crowd that will have medical ins because the government will pay for it.  And the deductible part they still won't be able to pay or don't want to pay and the taxpayers will still be paying for medical care for the masses.  Medical expenses and not going to change.  Everyone that needs medical today gets it one way or the other.  The government is adding another bureaucratic organization that will cost billions to operate.  Nothing the government does saves money.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2012, 01:18:53 PM by blue2 »
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lilly

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2012, 02:13:11 PM »

I don't get who it is that is going to have health insurance that doesn't have it now.  The people that can afford it have it now and those that live off the government still won't have money to buy health ins.  And that number is growing and will continue to grow.
Maybe it's the entitled crowd that will have medical ins because the government will pay for it.  And the deductible part they still won't be able to pay or don't want to pay and the taxpayers will still be paying for medical care for the masses.  Medical expenses and not going to change.  Everyone that needs medical today gets it one way or the other.  The government is adding another bureaucratic organization that will cost billions to operate.  Nothing the government does saves money.
If you keep mushrooms in the dark and feed them plenty of BS they will continue to thrive and grow.
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Forsythia

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #27 on: November 28, 2012, 02:33:51 PM »

I don't get who it is that is going to have health insurance that doesn't have it now.  The people that can afford it have it now and those that live off the government still won't have money to buy health ins.  And that number is growing and will continue to grow.
Maybe it's the entitled crowd that will have medical ins because the government will pay for it.  And the deductible part they still won't be able to pay or don't want to pay and the taxpayers will still be paying for medical care for the masses.  Medical expenses and not going to change.  Everyone that needs medical today gets it one way or the other.  The government is adding another bureaucratic organization that will cost billions to operate.  Nothing the government does saves money.

So you're with Romney and believe that people can just go to the emergency room?
« Last Edit: November 28, 2012, 02:39:06 PM by Forsythia »
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blue2

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #28 on: November 28, 2012, 04:59:22 PM »

Try to explain to me who is going to buy health insurance that can't afford to buy it now?  Are Romney's 47% going to be buying it?  If so where will they be getting the money.  They can't afford it now.
Is the government just going to wave the magic wand next year and everyone will have health ins?  How is that going to work?
I've talked with an administrator at Tol Hosp and they think they understand obamacare just a little but still believe they will be providing about $20 million a year in free health care because people will be coming to the hospital without insurance.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2012, 05:02:53 PM by blue2 »
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Will Sweat

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Re: The price of Obamacare.
« Reply #29 on: November 28, 2012, 05:22:11 PM »

Blue2,

Here is my understanding of this dilemma:  Those with incomes below 138% of the poverty level will be eligible for Medicaid (i.e. unemployed and underemployed among us).  Those who have an incomes above that level will be able obtain coverage through the state exchange and may be eligible for premium and cost-sharing subsidies.  It's not so much magic but everyone will have either health insurance (via Medicaid, Medicare, Private Insurance Provider or State Exchange) or they will be assessed a "fine". 

The Kaiser Foundation has a pretty neat chart that you can use to learn about various situations and how the reform may impact them. 

Kaiser Foundation:

http://healthreform.kff.org/profiles.aspx
« Last Edit: November 28, 2012, 05:27:47 PM by Will Sweat »
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