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old salt

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2007, 05:19:42 PM »

SMASH,

I only said 'WE' in that it's our money.

Everything else you said is correct. 

We are at the mall and the only ones fighting this war are our brave soldiers.
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Frenchfry

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2007, 05:46:43 PM »

old salt
Your chosen name seemed to require respect so I would often bite my tongue at your continual defense of Republicans but now that I know you're only 52…well that puts a whole new light on things.

I’m a little surprised you’d feel that way about 60 minutes since most old folks are the only ones watching it.

The news from Fox news is very slanted so perhaps a little more variety in your news sources could be in order.

It could just be a military thing since Republicans are known for their military spending and the Democrats use the money elsewhere.

All comments in this thread were from what other’s had said but you’re right about my feelings about Republicans and wrong if you think I support the Democrats.

I’m on the fence but many times I’ve been required to vote Democratic to ensure a Republican didn’t get into office.

Tort reform would be a disaster for citizens:
http://www.commondreams.org/news2004/1025-14.htm
This old story says “The Texas "tort reform" experiment, signed into law by Gov. George Bush in 1995 - and now held as the model for the national movement to restrict legal penalties against wrongful corporate behavior has proved to be a disaster for consumers, workers and small business owners, according to a new investigation by award-winning Southern Exposure magazine.

There MUST be access to legal recourse or else civility would take a giant step backwards resulting in bloodshed in the streets.

It’s the corporate greed that’s pulling the Bush puppet strings

The blame game is real easy and I could go on and on but now we need to focus on solutions.


« Last Edit: November 16, 2007, 08:40:52 PM by frenchfry »
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This is what I see when I visit:

"Sorry Frenchfry, you are banned from posting and sending personal messages on this forum.
This ban is not set to expire."

No emails, no warnings, no communication whatsoever...just that ban

May be what happened to the other libs as well.

I guess disabling the report to admin link only on the lib side was indicative of the slanted games they play.

Enjoy your spoon-fed Faux News type right-wing echo-chamber.

Edited to add:

This is the only way to answer some of the questions posed:

1) I did nothing to warrant the banishment, it's political.

2) It's the router that's blocked but considering all the nonsense right-wing games being played by those running the site...it's just not worth it to bypass the banishment block.

3) The moron stalkers from MT contemplating a visit will be considered a threat and can expect to have a bad day if they act upon those idiotic thoughts.

bumfunkegypt@live.com

SMASH

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #17 on: August 20, 2007, 07:06:56 PM »

Frenchfry,
How many Republicans were elected to get us out of wars or keep us out of wars, or limit the damage of wars?

American Civil War, Lincoln, the so called "First Republican".

WW1, Woodrow Wilson was kept in check by a Republican Congress that would not ratify the "Treaty of Versailles", which if you heard him, Saddam Hussein blamed for the unrest in the Middle East. The same Treaty that helped give rise to Adolf Hitler. Remember, Hitler made the French sign their surrender document in the same rail car that Treaty was signed in.

WW2, FDR got us in, the BOMB got us out.
Korea, Eisenhower, and all he got was a truce. That war ain't over yet. Military Industrial Complex? Ring a bell?
Vietnam, Kennedy said no, Johnson got us in, Nixon got us out. It was all a mess!!!!

Reagan, got our folks back from Iran after 444 days of captivity during the Carter administration. While Carter worked on schedules for his staff to play tennis on the White House courts.
Geo. H.W. Bush, obeyed the UN mandates and stopped the war during Desert Storm. Mistake?? New World Order?
Clinton? What a disaster as Commander in Chief!!! He still has messes all over the world we haven't cleaned up yet! Kosovo, Bosnia, Somolia, any more come to mind? OH, OH, don't forget Haiti?

Am I all wrong here?

Now this mess! A tragic error from the beginning. Never should have happened!
One common thread. New World Order baby.
Go to www.whitehouse.gov and read the bio on President Wilson, they even use those very same words. New World Order, what a concept, if you're the one in power and have ALL the money.
The Republican/Democrat Regime contains within itself those self anointed elites that know better for us simple folk than we do. As long as we fight amongst ourselves and the light is not shinning on them they go merrily on their way. To coin a lyric from Metallica, "Ripping and Tearing", our Constitution to shreds. All the while we say, " Thank you sir, may I please have another?"

I want my kids to continue to grow up in America, not their sick twisted version of Amerimexada. We as a people won't even come together to protect the very icon of our nation, our flag. Why should we hope to protect our Constitution? Most probably haven't even read it. Cause they damn sure don't teach it!!!

Peace.
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old salt

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #18 on: August 20, 2007, 07:21:29 PM »

FF,
I do keep an open mind from other news sources, but I'm often times disappointed - and the same goes for Fox news.  Fox can be slanted, but I just like their reporting better. 90% of my news comes from the internet - Yahoo, AP, etc.

I didn't read the torte reform link, but you didn't indicate why it would be bad.  There should always be recourse for incivility, but when you can sue over your own dumb actions?  Or you can be improperly compensated to the tune of hundreds of millions of dollars (which xx% goes to the lawyers).  You want solutions, how about limiting that % for the lawyer.  How about the losing lawyer pays the fees (for certain kind of cases).  What say you lawgirlmi?

I consider myself a conservative, not a republican.  I have a set of principles that I live by, and I'd like  our country to live by.  That's why I vote.

I never hear the principles of Democrats.  And what little I do hear (health care, susidizing, gun control, lack of support for our military) sounds too socialist for my liking.

Lately, I've had much disdain for the entire government.  Them and us have become a wussified nation and I take some of the blame (product of the 60's).

Let me know when you find some solutions.  I've offered a couple above.

Dinner awaits.  Later.
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Frenchfry

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #19 on: August 20, 2007, 08:39:09 PM »

SMASH
I am not as astute as you when it comes to the things you’ve mentioned but I have heard of the “new world order” and sadly I believe you are correct.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_World_Order_(conspiracy)

On a political tangent, here’s an interesting comment about lobbyists that was published August 17th;
http://nl.newsbank.com/nl-search/we/Archives?p_action=doc&p_docid=11B2622F7A724BA8&p_docnum=8

The farm bill, which recently cleared the House of Representatives, continues to provide wasteful subsidies to wealthy agribusiness. The auto industry used its money and muscle to discourage the House from increasing fuel efficiency standards. Pharmaceutical companies have lobbied hard and successfully against allowing the federal government to negotiate lower drug prices for seniors.

Corporations are not the only forces that "rig the system" and cripple the policy process. Veterans' groups have pushed Republicans into supporting a totally ill-advised ban on flag burning. Labor unions have bullied Democrats into compromising their traditional support for free trade. Both parties have allowed purists to polarize the debate over abortion, leaving the majority in the middle without a voice.

That's why we strongly favor the package of ethics reforms recently approved by Congress. Some of the most blatant ways of buying influence -- cheap trips on corporate jets, for example, or lavish entertaining of legislators -- would be banned.

The line between a legitimate campaign contribution and an illicit bribe can get pretty fuzzy at times, but the new bill at least illuminates the relationship between donor and lawmaker. Congressional and presidential candidates would have to identify supporters who collect or "bundle" campaign checks; and they would have to disclose their pet "earmarks," federal funds for specific projects that often reward top givers.


I couldn’t find the comment called “Bush undermining constitutional rights” published Sunday, August 19th on page 5C
It’s almost the whole right half of the page but I find it interesting.
http://www.rutherford.org/About/AboutJWW.asp
One negative comment was that the author, John W. Whitehead, head of the Rutherford Institute, has gone to great lengths to conceal the ideological leanings of his Christian Right legal center in statements to the mass media. He told the New York Times that "Oh, gosh, no," he had no political agenda in representing Paula Jones, and that he had founded the Rutherford Institute by himself. The New York Times reporter described The Rutherford Institute as "a kind of evangelical Christian civil liberties union."http://www.publiceye.org/conspire/clinton/Clintonculwar8-15.html


old salt
Thank goodness someone sees how slanted Fox news is.

Tort Reform is a "Bait and Switch" issue that would increase corporate profits by endangering our children with unsafe products and a toxic environment.
Republicans warn of frivolous lawsuits but tort law protects average people from negligent corporations that pursue profit above safety. It allows us to bring lawsuits against reckless companies that endanger our children with unsafe products, toxic waste and poorly tested medicine. “Torte Reform” would give these same companies legal immunity to expose everyone to asbestos and other hazardous waste, chemical pollution, risky drugs and dangerous products.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tort

Tort reform will not help our deficit so at this point it’s a non-issue.
Clinton had our deficit down to zero and Bush is spending like there’s no tomorrow which has damaged America and we need to close his access to the funds.
I would love to impeach Bush but the next President would just pardon him anyway…what a racket!

Revolution seems to be the only answer but even thinking that way is illegal.
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This is what I see when I visit:

"Sorry Frenchfry, you are banned from posting and sending personal messages on this forum.
This ban is not set to expire."

No emails, no warnings, no communication whatsoever...just that ban

May be what happened to the other libs as well.

I guess disabling the report to admin link only on the lib side was indicative of the slanted games they play.

Enjoy your spoon-fed Faux News type right-wing echo-chamber.

Edited to add:

This is the only way to answer some of the questions posed:

1) I did nothing to warrant the banishment, it's political.

2) It's the router that's blocked but considering all the nonsense right-wing games being played by those running the site...it's just not worth it to bypass the banishment block.

3) The moron stalkers from MT contemplating a visit will be considered a threat and can expect to have a bad day if they act upon those idiotic thoughts.

bumfunkegypt@live.com

Will Sweat

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #20 on: August 20, 2007, 08:47:27 PM »

Quote
I would love to impeach Bush but the next President would just pardon him anyway…what a racket!


Again, not defending President Bush but I am curious about the so called continued calls for "impeachment", under what grounds? 

I understand the disdain the people have for the President and this administration however, I do think that this continuing banter (i.e. Cindy Sheehan now going to run for office since the Democrats would not issue articles of impeachment) only cheapens the meaning and effect. 

Besides keep in mind politics are like weather - sooner or later your in the hot seat and do you really want someone else using your new definitions to attack? 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment#Impeachable_offenses
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John Kopke

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #21 on: August 20, 2007, 09:22:44 PM »

Much needs to be done about year in year out profligate goverment spending.  Yet, as FF rightly points out, it is the unfunded entitlements (SS, medicare, drug benefit) are the real danger to
our country's future.

Yet in all the various Dem and Republican debates we're seeing, I'm unaware that the subject has even been brought up. I realize the politicians are scared to death to address "third rail" issues,
but how come the media folks running the debates are steering clear?

Read an article today that said Fred Thompson plans to put front and center the coming entitlement tsunami. He realizes he may crash and burn because of it, but I believe even FF (whom hates all things republican) would applaud his bringing the subject to the fore in the coming campaign.
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sue lee

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #22 on: August 20, 2007, 09:43:11 PM »

This is a chart of the proposed Federal Budget http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/politics/interactives/budget08/category.html also the increases to each program. Please note the so called social entitlments have the smallest increases.
I am sure the budget is also very devious, as past budgets have been, with many programs under categories that they don't belong. We are slowly becoming the Military Industrial Complex that Ike warned about in the 50's
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Matt (formerly ML)

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #23 on: August 20, 2007, 11:13:33 PM »

Now, look at a newer bill. Say a five or a ten. Look at that stamp. It has magically turned into the Federal Reserve SYSTEM.

One of the justifications for the creation of the Federal Reserve was to prevent runs on banks that became insolvent. Here we are, 93 years later, and bank runs are still alive and well:
http://tinyurl.com/3dzbho

Coercive centralized fractional reserve banking is precisely what produced the ludicrous Zimbabwean $200,000-pound note (http://tinyurl.com/3czwmv), and that's exactly where this country is headed.
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SMASH

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #24 on: August 20, 2007, 11:56:44 PM »

Nice catch ML!

Please tell me again, just who caused the depression in 1929?
They told me in skool that FDR was this nations savior for fixing that mess?

How could there be a shortage of funds in the bank if people were walking around with certificates of deposit?

Peace.















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Frenchfry

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #25 on: September 03, 2007, 06:30:27 AM »

REBUILD THE MIDDLE CLASS

Friday, August 31, 2007
by Jim Hightower


It’s Labor Day weekend! Do you know where your middle class is?
In the ditch, that’s where. It’s been shoved there by callous and selfish profit-seekers rushing to get cheap labor in China and India, taking America’s middle-class jobs with them. It’s been shoved there, too, by Bush’s anti-government ideologues, who’ve been working feverishly to dismantle the middle-class framework of labor laws, health care, and pension protection. It’s been shoved there, as well, by a weak-kneed Democratic leadership that has lost touch with its populist roots, and by a conglomerate media establishment that has abandoned any connection to – much less concern for – working stiffs.

The economic and political elites crow that the U.S. economy continues to grow phenomenally – though they seem unaware that this growth is based on low incomes and low prospects for the great majority of Americans, while the benefits of growth are being piped to the very wealthiest families. Middle-class incomes continue to fall (even with families working three or four jobs) and poverty continues to rise. Yet the elites stride blithely by, oblivious to the fact that America is breaking apart beneath their well-shod feet.

When told that polls show that Americans are now worried about inflation, a clueless George W said, “They cite inflation?” You see, he’s told that inflation is up only 2.7 percent – but he’s totally ignorant of the fact that milk prices are up 13 percent in the past year, oranges 20 percent, dried beans 11 percent, and both bread and chicken up 10 percent. That’s nothing for the elites, but these are staples for the real America that the elites no longer see or hear.

A middle class exists only if workaday Americans demand it, fight for it, and build it. That’s what we must do between this Labor Day and next year’s – when we’ll be in the thick of a presidential race.


“Prices for Key Foods Are Rising Sharply” www.truthout.org August 14, 2007

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This is what I see when I visit:

"Sorry Frenchfry, you are banned from posting and sending personal messages on this forum.
This ban is not set to expire."

No emails, no warnings, no communication whatsoever...just that ban

May be what happened to the other libs as well.

I guess disabling the report to admin link only on the lib side was indicative of the slanted games they play.

Enjoy your spoon-fed Faux News type right-wing echo-chamber.

Edited to add:

This is the only way to answer some of the questions posed:

1) I did nothing to warrant the banishment, it's political.

2) It's the router that's blocked but considering all the nonsense right-wing games being played by those running the site...it's just not worth it to bypass the banishment block.

3) The moron stalkers from MT contemplating a visit will be considered a threat and can expect to have a bad day if they act upon those idiotic thoughts.

bumfunkegypt@live.com

Will Sweat

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #26 on: September 03, 2007, 07:30:53 AM »

Frenchfry;

Interesting thoughts by Mr. Hightowner.  I do have a question though; how doe he reoncile the fact that NAFTA and GAT were not passed by this President nor were they sponsored by anyone that could be considered his "crony"?

Jim Hightower proves,in my opinion, what is wrong with politics; it's easy to point fingers and yell, they did it, they did it. but instead offer your vision (including goals and actions steps to get there). 
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Frenchfry

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #27 on: September 06, 2007, 10:05:18 PM »

THE ECONOMICS OF GREED
Tuesday, September 4, 2007
by Jim Hightower

Wall Street’s financial elites are robust promoters of trickle-down economics. Provide special breaks for us speculators, they say, so we can amass royal fortunes – then, someday, someway, our massive gains will magically trickle down to the lower classes… (maybe).
That theory hasn’t worked out at all well for us hoi polloi, but the hoity toity are now learning that trickle-up economics actually does work, for they are seeing the financial stress of the “lower classes” rising up to swamp them. At issue is something called “subprime mortgages” – a banking phrase that’s mumbo-jumbo for “stealing from poor people.”

During the past several years, a complex network of local flimflammers, Wall Street hustlers, and global greedheads deliberately pushed millions of lower-income Americans into unaffordable, high-interest, high-fee home loans. Wall Street used these risky subprime mortgages to underwrite fast-buck securities sold to wealthy investors. It’s a slick scheme – as long as hard-hit poor people keep making their monthly loan payments. Guess what? They’re not. More than a million have defaulted in the past year, losing their homes and the money they put into them.
With the bottom falling out of the subprime market, all of those slicks up above suddenly have no support, and the whole house of cards is crashing. More than 80 mortgage companies have gone under in the past six months, such giants as Bear Stearns are taking billion-dollar hits, and “a wall of worry” has surrounded Wall Street.

Now the crisis is trickling into foreign money markets, from London to Shanghai. “Once it affects the U.S., it has ramifications right through the rest of the system,” says one market analyst. “We really are just at the beginning of this.”
Once again we’re learning that greed is not only bad morals – it’s bad economics as well.



Wall of worry about transparency takes toll on investment banks’ stock,” USA Today, August 2, 2007
“U.S. trouble extends to global markets,” USA Today, August 2, 2007
“Housing woes put a squeeze on corporate profits,” Austin American Statesman, August 2, 2007
“More Lenders Feel Pain From Defaults,” The New York Times, July, 31, 2007

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This is what I see when I visit:

"Sorry Frenchfry, you are banned from posting and sending personal messages on this forum.
This ban is not set to expire."

No emails, no warnings, no communication whatsoever...just that ban

May be what happened to the other libs as well.

I guess disabling the report to admin link only on the lib side was indicative of the slanted games they play.

Enjoy your spoon-fed Faux News type right-wing echo-chamber.

Edited to add:

This is the only way to answer some of the questions posed:

1) I did nothing to warrant the banishment, it's political.

2) It's the router that's blocked but considering all the nonsense right-wing games being played by those running the site...it's just not worth it to bypass the banishment block.

3) The moron stalkers from MT contemplating a visit will be considered a threat and can expect to have a bad day if they act upon those idiotic thoughts.

bumfunkegypt@live.com

riar

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #28 on: September 10, 2007, 11:57:47 AM »

60 Minutes re-aired this story;
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/03/01/60minutes/main2528226.shtml
http://www.cbsnews.com/sections/i_video/main500251.shtml?channel=60Sunday
I like the comments to the story on the first link.

U.S. Comptroller General David Walker runs the Government Accountability Office (GAO) and states he's totaled up our government's income, liabilities, and future obligations and concluded that our current standard of living is unsustainable unless some drastic action is taken. And he's not alone. It's been called the "dirty little secret everyone in Washington knows" – a set of financial truths so inconvenient that most elected officials don't even want to talk about them, which is exactly why David Walker does.

Walker has given up on elected officials and taken his message directly to taxpayers and opinion makers, hoping to shape the debate in the next presidential election.

You have heard this before, from Ross Perot 15 years ago. You might have even thought the problem had been solved, when President Clinton announced, "Tonight, I come before you to announce that the federal deficit … will be simply zero."
"Well, those days are gone. We've gone from surpluses to huge deficits and our long range situation is much worse," Walker says.

The Medicare problem is five times greater than the Social Security problem.
The president and the Congress made things much worse in Dec. 2003, when they expanded the Medicare program to include prescription drug coverage.
"The prescription drug bill was probably the most fiscally irresponsible piece of legislation since the 1960s," Walker argues.
Asked why, Walker says, "Well, because we promise way more than we can afford to keep. Eight trillion dollars added to what was already a 15 to $20 trillion under-funding. We're not being realistic. We can't afford the promises we've already made, much less to be able, piling on top of 'em."

He is not suggesting that the nation do away with Medicare or prescription drug benefits. He does believe the current health care system is way too expensive, and overrated.

"On cost we're number one in the world. We spend 50 percent more of our economy on health care than any nation on earth," he says.

"We have the largest uninsured population of any major industrialized nation. We have above average infant mortality, below average life expectancy, and much higher than average medical error rates for an industrialized nation," Walker points out.

Walker says we have promised almost unlimited healthcare to senior citizens who never see the bills, and the government already is borrowing money to pay them. He says the system is unsustainable.

"It's the number one fiscal challenge for the federal government, it's the number one fiscal challenge for state governments and it's the number one competitive challenge for American business. We're gonna have to dramatically and fundamentally reform our health care system in installments over the next 20 years,”

"And if we don't, it could bankrupt America"




The war is bankrupting America and this Administration had one agenda when they took office--to privatize all of America. No one paid attention when Bin Laden promised to "bankrupt" America. They did it to the Soviet Union. How many years did they fight in Afghanistan only to go home with their tail between their legs. I've blogged elsewhere the stupidity of fighting them on their turf so they don't come here is insanity. Terrorism isn't a nation. They have no turf. I asked if it every occurred to terror phobic citizens that terrorists are keeping us busy in Iraq like a cat with a mouse.

Our military is worn out. The push for privatization throughout the country leaves greedy corporate industry in charge of our lives so the middle class in being siphoned dry.  Some examples: Never before has a president opened our oil reserves without cutting off foreign imports. Major corporations got the benefit of those low prices from our own reserves, while we got to pay top dollar for the foreign stuff. This latest Holcim amendment is another example particular to Michigan. We are scared to death about losing jobs, so older plants that have nothing to lose are giving ultimatums. We're not going to comply or we'll shut our doors. Holcim is 60 years old. Handing them a special amendment only buys a short time for those jobs unless Holcim decides to renovate in the future, in which case they have a handy dandy amendment that exempts them from current DEQ laws. How many more older polluters are going to follow with ultimatums. Using the word ultimatum is being kind.

There has been so much finangling going on, I'm starting to think this administration is doing the same thing with Iraq as Bin Laden, using it as a diversion so no one notices the hostile takeover of America to privatization, in other words--the wealthy.  Read "The Great Iraq Swindle" How Bush Allowed an Army of For-Profit Contractors to Invade the U.S. Treasury:

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/story/16076312/the_great_iraq_swindle.

And we're gonna buy into the governement, GOVERNMENT accountablity office telling us social security and health care are bankrupting us? Yea right. What does the government accountability office say about the war? The takeover of the wealthy will be complete if we keep giving in to ultimatums by big companies that won't move forward to even clean up their mess. We're almost there. The wealthy just haven't put on their gold crowns yet.
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SMASH

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Re: U.S. Heading for financial trouble? (Fiscal wake up tour)
« Reply #29 on: September 10, 2007, 12:23:02 PM »

The GAO is correct. The unfunded mandates from the "New Deal" ARE bankrupting this nation.

Just who was it that told us a piece of paper was so valuable?
I'll try this again, just for the heck of it.

The money in your pocket is a fiat currency backed by NOTHING. It is borrowed dough. Borrowed on the credit of the nation, you and me. You may have mortgaged you house or have a car loan. The Federal Government mortgaged our whole nation in 1913 when the Federal Reserve Act was signed into law by Pres. Wilson.
Not to be out done, Pres. Roosevelt immediately upon being elected turned the citizens of this nation into criminals by signing four executive orders and through legalized extortion confiscated the nations privately held gold.

Everyone focuses on the war in Iraq because that's what the media rams down our collective throats every day. All the while they go happily along taking away our soverignty while we are looking the other way.

Check out the NAU and the SPP. Makes the war in Iraq look like a diversion? At whose expense?
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