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persecuted father

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #30 on: August 25, 2007, 09:07:20 AM »

I showed up at bobbys kitchen once on a wednsday at 7:30 waited around had dinner but dads of michigan never showed. I know not much can be done about the friend of the court, but to have someone to talk to would be helpful. As far as my EX not being the enemy WAKE UP !!!! My EX is my only enemy the court does not tell her to drag me into court two or three times a year, She does it on her own. She is bitter and hateful and wants to ruin my life if she can.
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chuntley

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #31 on: August 25, 2007, 10:38:25 AM »

I use to feel that way,, but the first time you get your pay check and it is your whole pay check,,, the hate melts away,,, kinda like telling her " you are fired,, no severance pay,, no vacation check,,, nothing!!!!!,,,, I had a tee shirt made up to celebrate the day,,, in fact I had 10 made so I could wear it everyday,, some men love it,, most women hate it hahaha.
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chuntley

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #32 on: August 25, 2007, 10:42:20 AM »

I hazve to say this to you and every man out there,,, never and I mean never ,, and if you have stop now,,,, talk bad about their mom,,,, they love her and you also,,,, one of you have to be the bigger person,,, so I repeat,,, never disscuse the break up,, the court hearing,,, your feelings for their mom,,,, nothing,,,,,,,keep it to yourself,,,,to me that is CHILD ABUSE
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persecuted father

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #33 on: August 25, 2007, 11:16:57 AM »

Because of my EX I havent even seen my children in over a year. I know it sounds like a cop out but it is true, the men she chooses always want to fight. I was tired of having to stay in my house I felt like I was hiding. She has alienated my kids from me, completely destroyed my relationship with them. Mabee someone should tell her that kids need both parents. Their stepdad told them he wants to adopt them and if they want to live with them he will buy them cars four wheelers and  a house with no rules and anything else they want ... all they had to do was give up on their dad.No problem there, what teenager wouldnt want that.
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sue lee

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #34 on: August 25, 2007, 11:36:04 AM »

chuntley,
you are so right, and it goes both ways. Never talk badly about the other parent. Kids do grow up, and they do form their own opinions as they grow. They will resent the negativity. It may be the most difficult thing you guys may ever do, but believe me it is worth it. Not only for you, but your children. Keep your mouth shut, and love them.
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chuntley

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #35 on: August 25, 2007, 11:54:21 AM »

IF they are teens then they are old enought to make their own choices,, be it good or bad , They chose to either avoid the hassle of hearing about wanting to see you it is just plain easier it avoid the conversation. This will probly last way past and into their adulthood. They are probly being told you are not supporting them and you are out having a good ole time..,

IT has been said "  The easiest way to break a man is to seperate him from his seed"

This holds true for a while and then the man rediscovers a stronger part of himself and lives off that, but the pain is still there, but he has figured out that the only person he can control his himself. All you can do is hope one day your kids will confront you about what they were told or just ask you about. THIS MIGHT TAKE 20 YEARS ,,,,,

What erver you do pay your child suppots even if you have to borrow the money,,, that is your obligatiln as a Man, To your advantage it will one day end. never forget that, everyday you wake that is one less day of the threat of the foc  ,,,,, :" THIS TOO SHALL PASS"
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sullivan

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #36 on: August 25, 2007, 11:59:53 AM »

I showed up at bobbys kitchen once on a wednsday at 7:30 waited around had dinner but dads of michigan never showed. I know not much can be done about the friend of the court, but to have someone to talk to would be helpful. As far as my EX not being the enemy WAKE UP !!!! My EX is my only enemy the court does not tell her to drag me into court two or three times a year, She does it on her own. She is bitter and hateful and wants to ruin my life if she can.

I'm sorry I missed you at Bobby's Kitchen as even I get discouraged at times of sitting in a meeting place by myself wondering WHY(?????)  if there are so many out there that feel abused by the family court system , that they don't come forward and UNITE  and try to accomplish positive change for themselves and more importantly their children???

There is the false assumption that children can be bought off by waving $$$$$ and a life style of no rules in front of them which I strongly disagree!!!
Could you have been bought away from either of your parents ??
Children want rules , because rules give their life stability and a sense of worth and value, they may protest initially but when there is proper application of love and discipline ( another adjective for love ) they are wise enough to discern why rules are important to them.

I have provided my real name and my phone number to you and anyone else that thinks I can be of assistance.
I have no magic wand to wave and make the hurt go away , but I have been at this for more years then I want to reflect upon and EDUCATION of the problem and root cause does give you a better understanding of how to combat and cope.

I can do no more then offer, so the ball is in the reader's court and my last comment comes from a movie called "Prince of Tides"about an adult with a dysfunctional childhood  background :( Nick Nolte's character)

"I DON'T REMEMBER WHEN MY PARENTS DECIDED TO DECLARE WAR UPON ONE ANOTHER ; BUT I DO KNOW THE ONLY PRISONERS THEY TOOK WERE THEIR CHILDREN."

That and the love I will carry to my grave for my 15year old  son Sullivan is what makes me so commited to the changes you and others would like to see within the family courts.
What will you do to make a difference for your children's future???

With Respect & Sensitivity
J. Pat Mc Elligott
DADS & MOMS of Michigan    
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persecuted father

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #37 on: August 25, 2007, 12:19:47 PM »

Do you have scheduled visitation? Or has it been revoked? If you have scheduled time, she can't keep them from you because she wants to! You have just as much right to take her into court.....Remember, you can always make more money and you can rebuild your credit...you can't get back time. Don't let her wear you down..Keep on fighting!
I had visitation or parenting time if you will..but.. as I said before I was tired of fighting with my EX and her husband, she filed papers saying the kids dont want to see me, I have kept these papers, then she comes out with " I dont know why you dont want to see your kids". You see , she likes to use the kids as a weapon and I refuse to allow her to do that, by me not seeing my kids I feel at least some of her games will stop. She can not claim abuse as if there is no contact there can be no accusation. parental alienation is hard to prove, but it is out there!!!!My kids know my number as they are teenagers and they have made no attempt to contact me.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2007, 12:24:52 PM by persecuted father »
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sullivan

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #38 on: August 25, 2007, 01:24:02 PM »

They probably have made no contact because their heads are being filled with BS. They will know no different if you don't step in....Sure, it may be easier not to fight with your ex, but it sounds like she has gotten what she wanted. Don't give her the satisfaction!

I have ask myself the same question as to why my 15 year old son does not just pick up the phone and call his dad???

These are my answers to my question??

When I was 15 , did I want to hang out and be with either of my parents or did I want to just be with my friends ??

Has my son EVER BEEN ENCOURAGED by his mother or his stepfather or even more importantly the multiple judges that have the power to ENFORCE parenting time to have a relationship with his father?

The element of FEAR and REJECTION  that is instilled into a child by the parent that primarily they draw their stability from (because that is the parent that holds the cards of physical custody) is very real to a child that is only being told one side of the story.

Children should not be brought into the vendetta wars of their parents but the reality is that most of the time they are.

It is also the reality that the courts will expend their energy and interest in child support ENFORCEMENT and NO energy or interest in parenting time ENFORCEMENT.

I try to keep my personal case exempt to a degree from "public airing of laundry" but will share this : I have been in front of (6 ) six  different family court judges over the span of 14 + years and NOT ONE of them ENFORCED my parenting time or even remotely advised or warned my son's mother that if she continued to violate and compromise and customize court orders to her self serving dictates that they would consider making her the non custodial parent or hold her in contempt and fine her and make her pay my attorney cost and lost time from work in requesting that the laws and orders of the court be ENFORCED.

It's simple to me that the JUDGE'S are at fault , because every time there is a court hearing the expenses incured weather they be attorney fees or F.O.C. procedural cost : JUSTIFY the family court's self serving agenda and continued job security.

Why do vindictive "sick" custodial parents violate the other parents time and relationship with their children ????

 Because they can!!!

Show me one Judge or family court official that will stop them !!! Make no mistake that IF they chose to they could.

So who is the real enemy??
 J. Pat Mc Elligott   
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lulu

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #39 on: August 25, 2007, 10:43:56 PM »

http://www.co.monroe.mi.us/monroe/default.aspx?PageId=399
Friend of the Court Handbook for Monroe County.

http://courts.michigan.gov/scao/services/focb/mcsf.htm
State of Michigan Child Support formula information page.

http://courts.michigan.gov/scao/services/focb/focb.htm
State of Michigan Friend of the Court

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sullivan

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #40 on: August 25, 2007, 11:20:08 PM »

http://www.co.monroe.mi.us/monroe/default.aspx?PageId=399
Friend of the Court Handbook for Monroe County.

http://courts.michigan.gov/scao/services/focb/mcsf.htm
State of Michigan Child Support formula information page.

http://courts.michigan.gov/scao/services/focb/focb.htm
State of Michigan Friend of the Court





Thanks Lulu!!!! Now if we could just get the authorities @ F.O.C. and the legal authorities that sit on the bench  to actually READ the Handbooks and Comply with what is written and ENFORCE , we may have a start on making the family courts more family friendly and civil ( heaven forbid that should happen because keeping the parties in flux assures MO MONEY $$$$ MO MONEY $$$$ )

As I have indicated before , the more hands on you are in knowing your rights as a parent regardless of the custodial arrangement ---the better off you are.

Don't expect F.O.C. or an attorney to do your job of educating yourself on the process.

It has always amazed me that most people watch the change given back to them by a store cashier but don't have a clue or research where their money paid through the F.O.C. goes . The same is true with custodial parents that complain they are not receiving the child support in a timely manner especially when it is being garnished from wages and sent by the employer.

Thousands and thousands of child support monies are lost within the system each year and the way it is corrected is to just put a debit on the payers account and try to collect the obligation again.

You have to prove to F.O.C. they received the money and if their records do not agree ---guess who's records they go by???

If both parties are in agreement you can ask to OPT OUT of F.O.C. collection and in those cases --it works much better for the persons involved and their children. The non-custodial parent feels he is not being held at gunpoint to pay what he should pay and many times feels compelled to pay more . The custodial parent is assured of receiving monies on time and not dependent upon a bureacratic system to protect her interest, when she dosn't need the assistance and have to wait for the U. S. mail or have her children's support money fall into that abyss of : Where did the money go???
 
 J. Pat Mc Elligott 
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chuntley

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #41 on: August 27, 2007, 07:46:36 AM »




If both parties are in agreement you can ask to OPT OUT of F.O.C. collection and in those cases --it works much better for the persons involved and their children. The non-custodial parent feels he is not being held at gunpoint to pay what he should pay and many times feels compelled to pay more . The custodial parent is assured of receiving monies on time and not dependent upon a bureacratic system to protect her interest, when she dosn't need the assistance and have to wait for the U. S. mail or have her children's support money fall into that abyss of : Where did the money go???
 
 J. Pat Mc Elligott 

Any monies given outside the friend of the court is considered a GIFT.
Lets say things are going fine for a few years and one of the parents decide to get involved with someone and the new husband or wife thinks that he or she is paying too much or too little. So now you are back in the system and you will be  asked to prove that your child support is up to date. Do not think your ex will say everything is good and up to date. You will have to provide every check you wrote and if the payee disagrees with the reason for the check,,, who will pay??
If you have a court order that gives an amount owed for child support please always mail or take the monies to the FOC office. Never trust that life will always be ROSIE,,, because at some time or another things will go back to the reason the two of you are not raising your kid together.

In life always do things as the payer to cover your butt  Keep good records,because the foc is covering the payee's

When dealing with the foc anger solves nothing, You can not tell those people at the foc that you think they need to learn to do their job and read the book,,, they will make your life a living hell as some one already knows. Be kind and take any disagreements up with the Judge be it Judge Weipert or Judge Holman they are both good and will be fare. In fact anytime you have a hearing let the ref. make his call then disagree with it and let the Judge make the final call.

This foc thing is not a war and you both have already lost the battle, it is about the kid and whether you are willing to let your kid be a casualty of your war. Sometimes you have to walk for the kids sake.
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persecuted father

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #42 on: September 05, 2007, 03:27:34 PM »

It is a war, and unfortunatley there are always innocent bystanders, when one parent cannot be happy they make the otherone miserable. I know I sound like the bitter ex- but I am not the one constantly running to the f.o.c asking for this and asking for that. I gave her what she wanted and now she wants more. I have 46 more months to deal with this person and I will be free of her forever, If I can just live that long I will be one happy person
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asmscorpion

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #43 on: September 15, 2007, 01:51:00 PM »


I have ask myself the same question as to why my 15 year old son does not just pick up the phone and call his dad???

These are my answers to my question??

When I was 15 , did I want to hang out and be with either of my parents or did I want to just be with my friends ??

Has my son EVER BEEN ENCOURAGED by his mother or his stepfather or even more importantly the multiple judges that have the power to ENFORCE parenting time to have a relationship with his father?

The element of FEAR and REJECTION  that is instilled into a child by the parent that primarily they draw their stability from (because that is the parent that holds the cards of physical custody) is very real to a child that is only being told one side of the story.

Children should not be brought into the vendetta wars of their parents but the reality is that most of the time they are.

It is also the reality that the courts will expend their energy and interest in child support ENFORCEMENT and NO energy or interest in parenting time ENFORCEMENT.

I try to keep my personal case exempt to a degree from "public airing of laundry" but will share this : I have been in front of (6 ) six  different family court judges over the span of 14 + years and NOT ONE of them ENFORCED my parenting time or even remotely advised or warned my son's mother that if she continued to violate and compromise and customize court orders to her self serving dictates that they would consider making her the non custodial parent or hold her in contempt and fine her and make her pay my attorney cost and lost time from work in requesting that the laws and orders of the court be ENFORCED.

It's simple to me that the JUDGE'S are at fault , because every time there is a court hearing the expenses incured weather they be attorney fees or F.O.C. procedural cost : JUSTIFY the family court's self serving agenda and continued job security.

Why do vindictive "sick" custodial parents violate the other parents time and relationship with their children ????

 Because they can!!!

Show me one Judge or family court official that will stop them !!! Make no mistake that IF they chose to they could.

So who is the real enemy??
 J. Pat Mc Elligott   

 Are you kidding me? Dont you think after six different family court judges, in two counties, maby the problem is you?? You 15 year old son doesn't call you because you are insane. He is terrified of you, because of what you have don to him.  
Let me count the reasons.......

   1) At 3 months old during a nightly feeding you smacked his leg because he wouldnt stop crying.
   2) Age 5, after a visitation, he came home bruised from head to toe from repeated beatings over a weekend visit
   3) at 8 yrs. old during a 'visitation' with you he was droped off at St. Marys park and told to run until you find me, pointed toward Rossler st. and then left. his Mother,(aka. Sick custoidal parent) luckly was driving up Elm st. and saw him running, in tears.
   4) Repeated incidents in which you have been arrested for beating his mother and him
   5) 15 years of physical and verbal abuse, including at 'recent' supervised visit that got out of hand,(which caused you voulantarly stop seeing your son, after a meidator stoped you from berating him.)

   You can fool some people Pat, but I know you. Spouting all this self rightous propaganda is typical of you. It is easy to sit in your house behind a computer and be brave, just like it is easy to hit on women and children.
 
   Don't think everyone won't see you as you really are, just like the court system, and the BIG government you are now trying to get elected to sees you.

   You are like a knock off designer suit, you look good for a while, but over time the frays and and faded colors reveal the sham.

   Hopefully this account, from his former step son, will answer his question,  

Who is the real enemy...............
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persecuted father

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Re: Is discrimination against the law or not ??
« Reply #44 on: September 19, 2007, 09:10:09 AM »

I didnt start this thread as a bash pat, although I do appreciate the information. I am not pat, I never abused my children or even raised a finger at my ex-wife , not even when we were married.I am not perfect no where near. I just want to get on with my life. I havent seen my kids in over a year in hopes my ex would leave me alone, but.... she will not, she is bitter even after eleven years. so I will have to defend myself from her persecution for 46 more months and then I will be free from her and the one sided friend of the court
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