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[sullivan]

My name is Pat Mc Elligott and I do many things in and around the Monroe County area but the most important is being a father to my son Sullivan. I have found out the hard way that the family courts are not family friendly thus I have been very active with others statewide in a Equal Parenting effort to bring reform ,civility and sanity to families whom the legal system has failed. I have a very informal meeting of our Monroe group at Bobby's Kitchen 15391 S. Dixie Hwy. Monroe, Mi.48161 on Wed. evenings between    7:30- 9:00 P.M to encourage, educate and discuss general topics regarding family court parenting issues in a candid an interactive forum.These discussions are geared toward any gender, age group or marital status with the only requirement being that unlike the system that tells you they are advocates for family, that you are TRULY interested in joining with others to discuss ways we can instill positive change for all families and especially our children and their future.The Best Parent is BOTH PARENTS because Children Need Both Parents!! Come find out about the Washington D.C.2007 Equal Parenting Rally & Bike Trek fom Lansing to Washington, D.C.   FREE WRIST BANDS :  CHILDREN NEED BOTH PARENTS     

[TPoKE]

When the parents are only using the system for their own personal issues...somebody has to step up and make sure that the childs best interest is being considered....stop using the system and act like a real parent should....take responsiblitiy for your own actions/mistakes and do the right thing by your children and the system wouldnt have to step in and make those choices for the child!!

If you and/or the child mother had your minds and hearts set on doing what is right for your child...the courts wouldnt be in it at all!!!!

[sullivan]

When the parents are only using the system for their own personal issues...somebody has to step up and make sure that the childs best interest is being considered....stop using the system and act like a real parent should....take responsiblitiy for your own actions/mistakes and do the right thing by your children and the system wouldnt have to step in and make those choices for the child!!

If you and/or the child mother had your minds and hearts set on doing what is right for your child...the courts wouldnt be in it at all!!!!

Sounds like TPoke is smoking something funny if they believe the judiciary and legal system are doing the right thing by families in dysfunction.It's not about helping family in distress Mr. or Mrs. TPoke , it's about exploiting family in distress for the ALMIGHTY $$$$. You are one of many ignorant to justice in America, but I won't take your ignorance personal but invite you to join me and others that have learned the hard way that we don't live in a Pollyanna environment especially in our family courts where the real losers are the children.We meet every Wed. @ Bobby's and I'll even buy you a cup of coffee as long as you come with an open mind to learn the reality of how our family courts have failed us all and become a wedge instead of a bridge .Please don't bring your rose colored glasses, Thanks for responding. J.Pat McElligott ( my real name as I don't believe in hiding in shadows )   

[TPoKE]

Sounds like TPoke is smoking something funny if they believe the judiciary and legal system are doing the right thing by families in dysfunction.It's not about helping family in distress Mr. or Mrs. TPoke , it's about exploiting family in distress for the ALMIGHTY $$$$. You are one of many ignorant to justice in America, but I won't take your ignorance personal but invite you to join me and others that have learned the hard way that we don't live in a Pollyanna environment especially in our family courts where the real losers are the children.We meet every Wed. @ Bobby's and I'll even buy you a cup of coffee as long as you come with an open mind to learn the reality of how our family courts have failed us all and become a wedge instead of a bridge .Please don't bring your rose colored glasses, Thanks for responding. J.Pat McElligott ( my real name as I don't believe in hiding in shadows ) 



I wouldnt share a dirty dish rag with you....unlike most others here, I know who you are and I know that you have serious issues...especially when it comes to your son! So dont talk like its me with the problem... Again I will say..."If you are doing what is in the best interest of the child PERIOD you wouldnt need to use the system to fix your messes!"...and then when you dont get what you want you cry about it!!!! PLEASE!! give me a break!!

You dont need to hide because most wont be bother with you anyway....and I dont dont hide, if I wanted whackos stalking me then I be so brave as to use my real name....but knowing that folks like you are on here, Uh, I'll pass!! :

[sullivan]

I believe your demeaning retoric speaks for itself and that readers of your post are not as ignorant as you think they are. You say you know me but obviously your opinion has been skewed by allegations ,half truths,etc. and because you don't have enough character to confront me on a one on one basis with your diatribe this will be the last post that I will address with you . I choose to take the high road and learn from interaction with most that I encounter, but I have a feeling trying to have an intelligent conversation with you would be like tuning in to the Jerry Springer show and trying to obtain someting positive.I'm sure you have your own agenda and reasons for attacking me but because of your perceived "fear" of whackos you will remain anonymous which according to Webster means : lack of purpose ,identity & rootless.I think that sums up my thoughts and I will not grace you or bore any other reader with an issue that you have personalized from your" perch in the shadows". J. Pat Mc Elligott ( some people don't have a problem being responsible for what they say or do: it's to bad you're not one of them!!!!)   

[Farmer.Ted]

All personal battles aside J. Pat, what is it you are trying to rally people to get involved with?

I personally don't understand.  Are you asking for automatic parental rights for those who have had theirs taken away?  Why were they taken away?
I find that our courts are more than fair in custodial disputes when EVERYTHING is on the up and up.
I am more in favor of removing parental rights from some of the people.
Parenting is not a right, it's a privilige just like driving.

[sullivan]

Parenting is a privelege Ted a privelege that should never be impaired by personal agenda, bias or vendetta.The family courts are a business and the business involves exploitation of family dysfunction for legal agenda greed and security.I am not saying that all people in our legal industry are bad but in general including our family courts the legal industry has our country held hostage because of fear of each other which sets them in position to enter our lives and usurp our authority for their own and charge us accordingly.You have obviously not had a first or even second hand experince of our family courts as they are anything but family friendly.I would be more then happy to show you live and in living color court room proceedings in my particular case that would make communist countries legal proceedings appear fair.You and many others obviously would be enlightnened by siting in court and observing the abuse and circus atmosphere of the avearage family court day. I will not go into my personal issues in this forum but if you contact me privately I will be more then happy to share.What am I trying to accomplish you ask?? Open communication and telling all of the things the judges and legal community wish to keep hidden from inquiring minds.I had no idea the extent of deceit, deception and agenda within the Monroe County legal community until I became embroiled in a heated divorce where a child was involved and I perceived in error that I could be a instrumental part of his life if I wanted to do my part from a financial and emotional and loving responsibility.How wrong I was!!! The young men and women fighting our latest wars as I did in Vietnam are being told they are fighting for others right to be free, but that freedom does not exist in our country if you make the critical mistake of free speech and criticize a judge or their peers or attack their" sheep being led to the slaughter" form of justice that unless you know better, others seem to buy in that the judiciary is fair. It is very political ,complicated and more emotional then most people want to think about , so we just allow our constitutional rights  to be violated and pay the piper. I encourage you to be real sensitive in the future of people in our family court system who for the most part crime is that they are in the high percentage of relationships that fail. The only ones satisfied with the status quo system are the ones that feed from the system like sharks while the real victims ( our children ) are left to another generation of dysfunction, and the $$$$$ keeps churning. Thanks for responding!!! J. Pat Mc Elligott 
 

[TPoKE]

I believe your demeaning retoric speaks for itself and that readers of your post are not as ignorant as you think they are. You say you know me but obviously your opinion has been skewed by allegations ,half truths,etc. and because you don't have enough character to confront me on a one on one basis with your diatribe this will be the last post that I will address with you . I choose to take the high road and learn from interaction with most that I encounter, but I have a feeling trying to have an intelligent conversation with you would be like tuning in to the Jerry Springer show and trying to obtain someting positive.I'm sure you have your own agenda and reasons for attacking me but because of your perceived "fear" of whackos you will remain anonymous which according to Webster means : lack of purpose ,identity & rootless.I think that sums up my thoughts and I will not grace you or bore any other reader with an issue that you have personalized from your" perch in the shadows". J. Pat Mc Elligott ( some people don't have a problem being responsible for what they say or do: it's to bad you're not one of them!!!!)   

speak about something you know....you dont know anything about me. I wont go back and forth with you because as I said, I know you and I know what you are about...and positive parenting isnt one of them. I have enough character to raise my children without the courts....what about you? I have enough character to tell the truth...what about you?...I have enough character to NOT blame others for my own faults or short comings as a parent or anything else for that matter....you?? No, you dont. I have talked to you before, which is why I wont do it (after this) anymore. You are a waste of time and you need psychiatric help. Learn to be a better parent and you wont be caught up in the courts fighting for something you dont deserve.

"Parenting is a privelege Ted a privelege that should never be impaired by personal agenda, bias or vendetta."......you should know, you've brought all of that into yours!!

I wont be responding again....its a free board, do what you will. I wont be subject to it.

and by the way...the truth must have hurt you cause it wasnt demeaning as much as it was the truth and you got plenty of attitude from what I said didnt you?  You're a sad sad man.

[Matt (formerly ML)]

Parenting is not a right, it's a privilige just like driving.

Let's look at the full implication of that statement.

The concept behind such a statement is that people do not own themselves, that their lives are subject to disposal at the whim of others. If parenting and driving are privileges, then so is everything you do, up to and including continuing to live.

This is precisely why ideas and concepts are so critically important.

[sullivan]

" ALL THAT IS NECESSARY FOR THE TRIUMPH OF EVIL IS THAT GOOD MEN & WOMEN DO NOTHING" para phrased from Edmund Burke statesman & philosopher. If I am to be found guilty of my actions and convictions , let them be for the right reason. If I suceed in life endeavors but fail as a father and as a parent then I have failed in life. Children Need Both Parents !!! J. Pat Mc Elligott

[Farmer.Ted]

Parenting is not a right, it's a privilige just like driving.

Let's look at the full implication of that statement.

The concept behind such a statement is that people do not own themselves, that their lives are subject to disposal at the whim of others. If parenting and driving are privileges, then so is everything you do, up to and including continuing to live.

This is precisely why ideas and concepts are so critically important.

I am not sure if we are agreeing on this but to expand on what I meant...  Isn't freedom a privilege, not a right?  And speaking on that, funny how we started this country on the phrase "god given right", but today you can't really say that now can you?
I say freedom is a privilege because that like anything can be taken away from you as can your rights.
Freedom is a facade people.  We are all just pawns....

[Matt (formerly ML)]

Parenting is not a right, it's a privilige just like driving.

Let's look at the full implication of that statement.

The concept behind such a statement isA that people do not own themselves, that their lives are subject to disposal at the whim of others. If parenting and driving are privileges, then so is everything you do, up to and including continuing to live.

This is precisely why ideas and concepts are so critically important.

I am not sure if we are agreeing on this but to expand on what I meant...  Isn't freedom a privilege, not a right? ...
I say freedom is a privilege because that like anything can be taken away from you as can your rights.
Freedom is a facade people.  We are all just pawns....

We are 180 degrees out of phase. Freedom is a right. You can do whatever you want, with one exception: you may not prevent anyone else from doing whatever they want.

If freedom was a privilege, you would have to ask permission to breathe.

Ask yourself: who owns you? There is only one possible answer. And you already know what that answer is. Everything else follows from that.

[sullivan]

 I'm not so sure but what this thread has strayed from my original intent which was to create dialog about parenting thoughts. I personally see parenting as more of a responsibility then a privilege like driving.I agree that if unimpaired by government intervention or others to the contrary and done in a positive manner ---parenting can be a rewarding  privilege.There are many in our society that have had that privilege,right ,freedom or whatever you wish to call it encroached ,impeded,violated  and even terminated ---not because they are bad parents but because there are counter productive legislation in place like Title IV funding to states that encourage single parent households and rewards the states with federal dollars to promote that financial agenda. A lot of people think because they have no children or their children are grown or they have been blessed with intact functional families that they have no interest in what goes on in our family courts.Many shoot from the hip regarding subjects they have not fully researched which is why Equal Parenting dialog falls on ears that do not hear because the perception is that the subjective legal terminology of" Best Interest of Children" is being administered.Greed & power coming fom our judiciary and legal society fueled by Title IV funding          ( which robs from the coffers of Social Security ) has created a UNFRIENDLY family court system concerned with" Best Interest of the Legal Society." Don't take my word for this--research this issue for yourself and see how deep the roots of deception and status quo greed go creating more and more social dysfunction by excluding one parent from the formula of raising a child. Children want & need  both parents. Research why this is not the goal of our family courts and in particular our judiciary.         J. Pat Mc Elligott     

[the nosh]

not sure what you are all about j pat...but your name certainly is familiar to me! obviously tpoke has a problem with you or what you are about or did in the past...i really dont know. but what i do know is..there is a reason they call... the friend of the court...the fiend of the court!!

[JKC]

I don't have any experience with the Monroe courts so I can't speak to that but there MUST be some reason why the court removes parental rights from some people.....and I noticed that no one has stated what some of those reasons are?  Was there drug or alcohol abuse?  Are you psychologically strong?  Were you abusive towards the other parent or the child?  After age 13, most courts allow the chldren to have a major say on who they want to be with......are the children this age?

There must be SOME reason why the courts ruled against you....so instead of just throwing these blanket statements out, can you elaborate?  Otherwise you just come off the exact opposite of what I think you want to appear as. 

I don't make snap judgements until I hear from both sides and the WHOLE story, so please elaborate........