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the nosh

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Re: Former restaurateur sentenced to 8 months
« Reply #285 on: July 13, 2008, 08:03:54 PM »

Ok... Let me share again.. this time drawing agian from personal experience... I was not always as smart as I am now... in 1988.. I just moved to Tampa.. I had a pretty good job working for a managed care company that was privately owned by a doctor.. he was a "celebrity" doctor in this area... meaning he was on TV a lot.. at the time he interviewed Ted Bundy... I was his hand maiden for awhile.. he was OK never did anything inappropriate... then I was put in charge of a pilot program we were working on with Dunn and Bradstreet.. and a big insurance company... This was a big feather in my cap... keep in mind this was my first "real" job... in my new life outside of being a drunken slag that life's ambition was working at Sportman's bar... so I had never been in the "office" world before.. and I did not know anything.. I had always worked in Bars and Restaurants...

So I was heading this project and they bring in this doctor to work with me from Miami... I had to work very closely with this man because we were using a new criteria to determine if people met criteria to be hospitalized for psychiatric and substance abuse... It started almost immediately... the hands on my rear end is what I remember mostly... I was not the only one he was being very inappropiate with.. there was another girl too.. anyway.. It always was a challange trying to keep his hands off me.. then finding sexually suggested porn pics clipped out of magazines on my desk.. I went to the personel director and told her.. then I was called into the big directors office and was told... that I did not understand Cuban (he was cuban and so was the director) men... Oh both the personel director and the CEO were women... and that I just needed to relax...  so it continued.. until one time I was working late.. and I thought I was the only one there.. I had left my cubical area... and when I came back there he was.. he was sitting in my chair.. pulled me down and was all over me.. the man would of raped me.. I am sure of this... I could feel his erection against my body... he was kissing me and telling me that he was going to give me the ***** of my life... The more I fought the more it excited him...then the cleaning people came in... and that is the only thing that saved me... I know one of the cleaning women asked me if I was ok.. she could tell something was going on.. he told them we were just having some fun... I called off the next two days and made an appointment with the Ceo.. I told her what had happened and demanded that something be done.. I even asked her to talk to the cleaning people they saw him on top of me...

I loved this job... and the project we were working on.. I was moved to a different project and laidoff a week later...  The other girl who was harrassed would not come forward because she was afraid of losing her job... I did not know what to do... I knew nothing of sexual harrassment.. I was 27 years old and stupid.. I had never been in the "corporate" world before.. I later found out from the personel director (after she left the company I ran into her)  that this doctor was there because he was getting paid next to nothing.. because he was not allowed to have contact with female patients because of allegations made againts him by three of his clients... The Doctor that owned the company was using his fame and clout to "help" him keep his license... So that CEO knew he had a history... and they chose him and his ability to make them money.. knowing that he is a preditor..

Again.. I was young and stupid.. He got his full license reinstated.. because of the other doctors help.. again.. sexual harrassment has to be proved.  Most companies think to protect themselves... so who do you believe?  Who is more profitable to keep?... if an employee does complain like I did.. If they act on it.. who will they be sued by?  So why did I stay after the first incident happened.. I needed the Job.. I did not know my rights.. and even if you do say something you run the risk of being let go... like I was!

No there are no sexual harrassment police to call.. no guide books... in 1988 we did not talk about such things... but things like this have gone on in the work place for years... most women can tell you.  My aunt use to work for Chevy hydromatic in Toledo.. and quite after six years... this was in the 1960's and there were not a lot of women working factories... I asked her onetime why she would quit chevy.. to work at Union Camp... She told me she could not put up with her foreman anymore and his sexual advances... now again grown woman.. she was tough too!!!  Actually quit a much better job to work in a paper mill... but she had to... that is the way the world worked then... and to some extent still does today.. even if you are being harrassed in the work place.. you have to prove it!  In the mean time you still need a job... and you need that job reference.. you can't tell you new prospective employer "oh I was sexually harrassed at my last job so now I need a new one"... that throws red flags all over the place..

The reality is... we are not handed a guide book in life... and now you are asking "why" a 16 or 17 year old does not leave.. or report it... look at the consequences they face if they do!  You are also asking why a person who is of this age.. well again.. you want to be liked.. you want to earn money.. you are wanting to be an adult.. but you are not equipped with the mental faculty to think like an adult... Even at 27 years of age.. I did not know what to do.. What I should of done was kept a written diary of when things occured... when I reported them... and hired a lawyer and sued.. but I was raised that sueing people was wrong!   I know differntly now that is the only recourse a person has... but at 27 in 1988 I did not know that...

Everyone can be a monday morning quarterback... again we need to look at the people involved... and hold those accountable... How many of you know who to report things to?  Again in cases like these you have to get your own attorney... how many 16 and 17 year olds know this!...

Then you see people who ask these questions... there is a pattern.... a patholgy.. again it comes to judgement... who is accountable.. and who is the adult..  As parents teach your children about boundaries.. when the line should be... and how to know when it is crossed.. then what to do about it.  

I will stop now...








well let me tell you about some women that work in factories...not saying this about all women but quite a few that i have seen. i worked at a downriver steel company at one time...most everyone needed to work in pairs due to safety issues. trust me...some women would come into a steel mill with good clothes on...just knowing they would get one of the best jobs, easy jobs due to them being a good looking female. now im sure you wont agree that it is right that it was that way. but thats how it was and im sure it just wasnt steel mills.

so yes...men do and did have issues with women in factories. some could not do the job...so they got put on easy jobs...was that right? no...but thats how it was. so resentment was the norm for alot of them that worked there!! of course this has nothing to do with the topic...and to be honest i stopped reading your post at this point.

its like women dont belong on war ships in the navy also. that is my honest opinion of that also!

so like it...or lump it. thats how i feel about it all! then...and now!  ;D
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tampachicken

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Re: Former restaurateur sentenced to 8 months
« Reply #286 on: July 13, 2008, 08:41:40 PM »



A closed mind is never a terrible thing to waste.....
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the nosh

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Re: Former restaurateur sentenced to 8 months
« Reply #287 on: July 13, 2008, 08:43:37 PM »


A closed mind is never a terrible thing to waste.....




whatever you think!
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Lethlweapn

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Re: Former restaurateur sentenced to 8 months
« Reply #288 on: July 13, 2008, 08:46:21 PM »


A closed mind is never a terrible thing to waste.....

I don't know about his mind being closed, but being wasted (i.e. having too much to drink tonight), may be a bit closer to the truth.

I along with many others on here TC feel for you and for what you have had to go through. Last night I spent some time with some people on here that had nothing but good things to say about you. I hope that one day we will get the chance to meet as well.
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teerose

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Re: Former restaurateur sentenced to 8 months
« Reply #289 on: July 13, 2008, 11:01:52 PM »

so yes...men do and did have issues with women in factories. some could not do the job...so they got put on easy jobs...was that right? no...but thats how it was. so resentment was the norm for alot of them that worked there!! of course this has nothing to do with the topic...and to be honest i stopped reading your post at this point.

its like women dont belong on war ships in the navy also. that is my honest opinion of that also!

so like it...or lump it. thats how i feel about it all! then...and now!  ;D

Well, as much as I hate to admit this.... i must agree with you Nosh.  I currently work in a steel mill and ironically also used to be in the Navy.  I have seen many a women take advantage of the system, the union, etc... by using her looks or flirting her way through difficult situations.  I have seen men's careers and marriages ruined, promotions given to women that didn't deserve it and hate and discontent amongst the ranks because some girl was getting the easy jobs but getting equal pay... I get VERY aggravated with women that cry sexual harassment when it just isn't....  tampachicken's version WAS....  the girls at Jeff's place... don't think so...  If charges would have been filed the very next day... maybe.  but this went on and on (like this thread).  Like tampa chicken, I too have been in the work place for many years (born 1962) and sometimes i am embarrassed by the way BAD women make the rest of us look... way off the subject but the same thing for divorce.... raking men over the coals, nickel and diming for support/alimony... NOT all women are like that... but i have to admit there are many.
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raspberryrose

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Re: Former restaurateur sentenced to 8 months
« Reply #290 on: July 13, 2008, 11:27:36 PM »

Well, as much as I hate to admit this.... i must agree with you Nosh.  I currently work in a steel mill and ironically also used to be in the Navy.  I have seen many a women take advantage of the system, the union, etc... by using her looks or flirting her way through difficult situations.  I have seen men's careers and marriages ruined, promotions given to women that didn't deserve it and hate and discontent amongst the ranks because some girl was getting the easy jobs but getting equal pay... I get VERY aggravated with women that cry sexual harassment when it just isn't....  tampachicken's version WAS....  the girls at Jeff's place... don't think so...  If charges would have been filed the very next day... maybe.  but this went on and on (like this thread).  Like tampa chicken, I too have been in the work place for many years (born 1962) and sometimes i am embarrassed by the way BAD women make the rest of us look... way off the subject but the same thing for divorce.... raking men over the coals, nickel and diming for support/alimony... NOT all women are like that... but i have to admit there are many.

teerose & nosh....I agree right along with you.  I've experienced it for myself....Ford Motor Co. in the 70's and the Power Plant in the 80's and 90's.  tampachicken...I've been there too and I hear everything that you're saying...I have a few stories of my own....just don't have the time right now to tell them.
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the nosh

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Re: Former restaurateur sentenced to 8 months
« Reply #291 on: July 14, 2008, 07:04:44 AM »

Well, as much as I hate to admit this.... i must agree with you Nosh.  I currently work in a steel mill and ironically also used to be in the Navy.  I have seen many a women take advantage of the system, the union, etc... by using her looks or flirting her way through difficult situations.  I have seen men's careers and marriages ruined, promotions given to women that didn't deserve it and hate and discontent amongst the ranks because some girl was getting the easy jobs but getting equal pay... I get VERY aggravated with women that cry sexual harassment when it just isn't....  tampachicken's version WAS....  the girls at Jeff's place... don't think so...  If charges would have been filed the very next day... maybe.  but this went on and on (like this thread).  Like tampa chicken, I too have been in the work place for many years (born 1962) and sometimes i am embarrassed by the way BAD women make the rest of us look... way off the subject but the same thing for divorce.... raking men over the coals, nickel and diming for support/alimony... NOT all women are like that... but i have to admit there are many.



thank you teerose and i agree...not all are like that! but it happens everywhere!

and lethal...i only had a couple!! i normally dont drink on nights that i have to go to work the next day lol...but it was a special occasion!  ;)
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the nosh

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Re: Former restaurateur sentenced to 8 months
« Reply #292 on: July 14, 2008, 07:06:05 AM »

teerose & nosh....I agree right along with you.  I've experienced it for myself....Ford Motor Co. in the 70's and the Power Plant in the 80's and 90's.  tampachicken...I've been there too and I hear everything that you're saying...I have a few stories of my own....just don't have the time right now to tell them.




and raspberryrose too!! you are two very honest women!!  ;)
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newbie

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Re: Former restaurateur sentenced to 8 months
« Reply #293 on: July 14, 2008, 08:30:29 AM »

Because of many requests I have decided to lock this thread.   Too much controversy and bickering over old news!  This case was settle in the courts- over and done already!!!  Thanks to all who had serious posts.
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