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[SMASH]

I posted up a link to this a long time ago. Now the verdict is in and Robert "Bobby" Kahre has DEFEATED the IRS!!!
All 161 charges brought against him, his employees, and his family. Not one convition!

http://www.newswithviews.com/brownfield/brownfield67.htm

Why have we not heard about any of this?
Why don't they want us to know?

Why did the IRS, SWAT, and the FBI purposely attempt to destroy all evidance of their CRIMES against this law abiding citizen?

Why the hell should you care?

I'll tell you why.
For all of the posting and conversation that goes in this forum, regarding all the different topics, we always dance around the core, common denominator.
MONEY.

All of the issues, all of the social ills, all of the talk about oil, gas prices, and who gets paid what, all go back to MONEY.
Most of us use the same currency, because most of us are completely ignorant of the FACT we do have a dual currency system in this nation.
Robert Kahre(pronounced, CARRY) proved it beyond a shadow of a doubt. The IRS was forced, for the time being, to OBEY the Constitution!

Article 1, Section 10 still stands today. Due to this case they will be coming after it.

Stop beating around the bush folks, our currency IS THE CAUSE OF OUR NATION'S ILLS.
Don't believe it?
You could still buy gas at approximately 20 cents a gallon with silver today!
Look at silver prices to the dollar, do the division yourself.

Imagine this.
If, and when the dollars falls your 401 will be worth nothing.
Your IRA, your Savings Bonds, your Mutual Funds, you CD's will be worth ZERO if they are vested and paid only in US Dollars.
The rest of the WORLD has recognized the vulnerability of this nation through the weakness of the currency.
Many nations around the world are diesting themselves of the US Dollar. What do they know our Ministry of Propaganda is NOT telling us?

This IS not a "sky is falling" topic. It is an attempt by me simply to share with you all the things I have learned over the past two years following and researching this subject.
I have much to share in both video and links to various articles.
We can go as fast as you folks would like.
This should be fun.
I hope to learn even more as the conversation develops.

[Frenchfry]

So are you saying we should stop using money and carry around scales to weigh out silver?

[Lethlweapn]

So are you saying we should stop using money and carry around scales to weigh out silver?

That would not work Fry, it has to be coined.

If the coin has a value of say $50 because of the silver content, but is printed as a $1 Silver coin. He can pay them the $50, by giving them the $1 coin, and state that he only gave them $1. Thereby avoiding having to pay income tax, and social security tax, etc. He avoids paying his share of the social security tax also.

But, when it comes time for them to collect social security, they will not get as much as if they were paying the proper amount. But if they take that money and invest it, they might be better off.

[SMASH]

So are you saying we should stop using money and carry around scales to weigh out silver?

The U.S. mint currently produces gold and silver coins that are legal tender.

Remember we used to have bills that were basically in effect "warehouse certificates". They were called silver certificates.
They are simply coupons, redeemable for the metal on deposit.

That is what made it so easy for FDR to seize most folks gold in 1933 when he closed the banks and confiscated the private property of American citizens. Most folks never asked for the gold, they trusted in the paper!

This link gives an outline of the "New Deal". Enjoy.
http://www.authentichistory.com/1930s/fdr/newdealoutline.html

Notice in June of 1933 the FDIC was born.
Who owns and operates the FDIC?
The Federal Reserve.
Who owns the Federal Reserve?

[SMASH]

That would not work Fry, it has to be coined.

If the coin has a value of say $50 because of the silver content, but is printed as a $1 Silver coin. He can pay them the $50, by giving them the $1 coin, and state that he only gave them $1. Thereby avoiding having to pay income tax, and social security tax, etc. He avoids paying his share of the social security tax also.

But, when it comes time for them to collect social security, they will not get as much as if they were paying the proper amount. But if they take that money and invest it, they might be better off.

You bring up a valid point about Social Security.

Social Security is also paid out in Federal Reserve Notes. If they no longer remain, what will you be paid in?
Keep this in mind. There is no Social Security Trust Fund, in the true sense of the word. It is a trust the government fund. If I cooked the books in my small business the way the government does I WOULD BE THROWN IN PRISON!!!!!

David Walker, former Comptroller General of the GAO, explains it great in this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-16u9x3tfE

It's about 9 minutes long but gets straight to the point.

I appreciate you bringing up SS but if we can I would like to stick to currency issues for the time being. This discussion will inevitably get to many other topics soon enough, agreed?

[SMASH]

You know what I don't get SMASH - Union guys who whine and cry that they only get paid to go up to this point or that amount of effort.  If they exceed in theire performance, they demand retro-pay, back wages, or immediate increase.

They get violent over each dollar of their paycheck - but in the grand scheme of things, any one of these guys' pensions or 401k's could take a $80,000 or $150,000 hit in one day as the dollar tanks globally - which is not the last 40 to 60 hours they just spent working, but the last 20 - 30 years working - and they demand their employer recover their losses through unions and federal wage controls - which only increase inflation and unemployment!!!

Why aren't they listening to Ron Paul - as well as your advice?

First of all let me begin at your ending.
It is not my intention to give anyone "advice" in this content or context.
As I said when I started this topic my intent is to share and learn.

I am by NO MEANS an authority or in any way a scholar of monetary policy or banking.
I have just learned from experience and research how we are all getting SCREWED by a system set up against us all and potentially doom our nation. The bankers will win! They always do.
Time and again, one currency collapses and they ride in like white knights on giant horses to the rescue. With another FIAT currency and bloated loans the bankrupt country can NEVER pay back.

How many stories of "Debt Relief" have you heard of coming out of the U.N.?
Why the U.N.?
The U.N. is not a bank, are they?
Or, are they?

At this point I will not engage your comments on Union workers or the policies of the unions v. companies and their contracts. I don't have the knowledge or expertise to address those issues.

We, from all stripes, need to gain a better knowledge about the "money" we all carry around and use before we start nitpicking how that money is used.
I am sure we will get to the topic of inflation as this conversation progresses.

Watch this.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=LEsEvb1WsIY&feature=related
I have a couple of graduation parties to attend tonight, so I must retire for the evening.
i will check in tomorrow.

OBEY

[SMASH]

Well, we discussed Bobby Kahre briefly.
I hope everyone had an opportunity to follow the links to et a better understanding of just what the government and their thugs have done to him!!

Has anyone heard of or been following what happened to Liberty Dollar?

http://www.libertydollar.org/

This is but another example of the government putting their collective boots on the throat of law abiding citizens.
The coverage of these stories, or lack thereof, are a story in and of itself! In the respect there is very little.
The owner of Liberty Dollar fully expects to be arrested for his alleged crimes, and I fully expect the outcome to be the same as with Mr. Kahre.

Other currencies were brought up in another topic just today.
For more informational purposes I will put up the existing links I have to those coins here also.

http://www.dc-coin.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWCATS&Category=8

Again, Mr. Carr is no stranger to those at the US Mint, as was Bernard von NotHaus of Liberty Dollar.
These men know and understand MONEY.
How it is created, manufactured, distributed, and spent.

Mr. Carr freely admits that at some time his "fantasy" coins may become illegal to manufacture?
Why?
Will owning gold and silver become illegal too? It has been in the past.
Or, will his "fantasy" coins become in some fashion the "legal tender" of this country?
We can only speculate on that one.
Only the US Mint can mint the "legal tender" for the US of A, per the Constitution.
Article 1, Section 8, Paragraph 5.
 
There is one thing I have not been able to get an answer to.

On the Designs Computed website scroll down and  look at the pictures of the coins.
At the 5 o'clock position you can clearly see a "D" hallmark on some of the coins.
Some have the "D" hallmark below the wings at the lower tip of the eagles wing.
What is that?
Is it something directly related to DC Coins, or is it a "D" hallmark signifying the US Mint in Denver?
Makes one wonder.


Take aminute and check out the "Google Trends" comparing coverage of the IRS, the Amero, Liberty Dollar, and the US Dollar. it's no wonder we are in the dark about our own currency.
Yet the rest of the world is curious.

[SMASH]

How much did a Ford Mustang cost in 1968?

How much does one cost today?

[SMASH]

Come on somebody must know.

Help!!!

[Bedfordres]

I'll say $3000.  I bought a new chevy in '65 for $3500.

[SMASH]

I'll say $3000.  I bought a new chevy in '65 for $3500.

O.K. Thanks.

Using that figure let's do some math.

Silver as of 1:30 this afternoon was at $18.43 per oz.
At that rate 3000 1968 silver dollars are worth $55290.00

You can still by a Mustang for $3000.00!!!!
Your paper is just worth less!!!!!

The bankers at the IMF and World Bank are screwing us.

[The Truth]

Thank you SMASH.  This is something everyone needs to learn more about.

Too bad every politician fails to address the issue, and uses economic problems to rationalize their own impotent pet policies.  You hear McCain and Obama blame gas prices on supply-and-demand and speculators and this and that, never considering that the absolute price of oil hasn't actually risen in like 20 years, and that their "solutions" are only going to weaken the dollar more.  It's a tragedy.

That's the truth.

[SMASH]

Thank you SMASH.  This is something everyone needs to learn more about.

Too bad every politician fails to address the issue, and uses economic problems to rationalize their own impotent pet policies.  You hear McCain and Obama blame gas prices on supply-and-demand and speculators and this and that, never considering that the absolute price of oil hasn't actually risen in like 20 years, and that their "solutions" are only going to weaken the dollar more.  It's a tragedy.

That's the truth.

As I have said before, Obama and McCain are owned by those that feed us their paper money.

I have challenged folks before to look into the members of the CFR.
I have asked folks to look into the campaign contributions by members of the CFR and Wall St.(World Bankers) to both Obama and McCain.

Those that own the money own the politicians.

Mayer Rothschild said, "Give me control of a nations money, and I care not who makes it's laws."

[T-M-T]

As I have said before, Obama and McCain are owned by those that feed us their paper money.

I have challenged folks before to look into the members of the CFR.
I have asked folks to look into the campaign contributions by members of the CFR and Wall St.(World Bankers) to both Obama and McCain.

Those that own the money own the politicians.

Mayer Rothschild said, "Give me control of a nations money, and I care not who makes it's laws."

You post a lot of interesting information and theories, which I appreciate, and you seem to have a better-than-average grasp on economics.  How about some practical. possible solutions?  How do you propose we go about making things better?  (Please don't mention Ron Paul again.  Remember that I said "possible.") 

I am sincerely interested in the steps you believe that we, as citizens, should take.

[SMASH]

You post a lot of interesting information and theories, which I appreciate, and you seem to have a better-than-average grasp on economics.  How about some practical. possible solutions?  How do you propose we go about making things better?  (Please don't mention Ron Paul again.  Remember that I said "possible.") 

I am sincerely interested in the steps you believe that we, as citizens, should take.

One thing we can do is support businesses like Liberty Dollar.
The one thing that they have not done yet is secure a network of merchants who will utilize their product. Since gold and silver are quickly becoming solid investments that may change.

If the story of Mr. Kahre were to spread in the small business community and they recognized the potential tax benefits of gold and silver coin that would help bring into the mainstream usage of the medium.

The citizenry asking businesses about paying for their purchases in silver would also perk up interest.

One practical thing I have already done is to divest myself of all items in my portfolio that were invested only in US Dollars.
I cashed in ALL of my US Government Savings Bonds. Took the proceeds and purchased silver. In various mediums. Some Liberty Dollars, some US Mint coins that are legal tender, and some bullion bars. I did not purchase any "Collectible" coins. I am looking for monetary value in silver, not intrinsic value. Besides, I have no knowledge in numismatics at all. I would probably get soaked trying to buy those types of items.

I realize it took us since 1913 to get to where we are today, monetarily. We are not going to get out over night.
We should be smart enough to watch what the rest of the world is doing. They are dumping the FRN, so should we.
Remember, the FRN is simply the Federal Reserves money it is NOT ours. They are a private institution, not our government! We(the American people and Government) borrow money from THEM. We, can choose not to use their money any more. That's why our Congress instituted the dual currency system. It's up to us to educate ourselves and opt out of their rigged game.
The neat part is we need no new laws to do so, they are already in place.